Right.

So there's, th- I think that could surprise people, and it could also, depending on the person interpreting it, which is why you didn't ask this, but why social media can be a little tricky for parents is, like, people speak with tremendous confidence about-

Yep.

Uh, that's not true, with friends.

And I was like, "I have spent your adolescence being the parent that was like, 'I'm not gonna stare at your location.

I'm not gonna...

I'm, I'm gonna put my money where my mouth is.'"

Do you see a pattern where it often goes wrong in those first years of life?

Well, I think we see this in the research.

There are three sort of general parenting styles.

W- One, a f- a fourth one would be neglect, and we're not addressing that 'cause that's like, of course that's gonna go terribly wrong.

But the three more typical parenting styles are permissive, authoritative, and authoritarian, and they're measured on two dimensions.

Sensitivity and warmth is one, and kind of limits and expectations is the other.

And when you have someone who's high warmth, really sensitive to their child's needs, incredibly present, and connected, but low on having limits and boundaries, that's called permissive parenting.

[laughs]

So I always think about these kinds of disconnects as knowing-doing gaps, and I'm curious about what your biggest one is.

My biggest one, and actually my younger daughter called me out on this.

This was such a silly small thing, but it really does capture my parenting, where I feel pretty good about how autonomy supportive I am, and we can talk about what that means, but it's pretty good parenting.

And she was having a bat mitzvah, this was many years ago, and she was wearing a dress, and I was getting shoes with her, and I said, "Get whatever shoes you want.

Doesn't matter." And then I basically encouraged her to get silver instead of gold shoes, okay? And every shoe that she wanted, I was steering her away back to the silver shoes.

And then I ordered a pair of silver shoes just in case for her to try on both.

And she said to me, "Why don't you just tell me that I don't have a choice and that I can't wear whatever shoes I want? You know, like, why are you pretending that you're so open with this particular thing? Why don't you just say, 'Hey, there are certain things that I am not giving you a choice on?'" [laughs] "And don't make it out to be like, 'Oh, I made this decision.'" And basically, she was calling me out on something I do at, at a much bigger scale that is a flaw, which is I want to do the thing that I should be doing of autonomy support, but sometimes I'm like, "Ugh, I'm just, I know so much better," and so I'm gonna intervene when I shouldn't.

Can you talk to me a little bit about how to enforce a boundary and maybe how that evolves by age?

Mm

... which is not avoidant or insecure attachment.

And it's just the idea that, like, when you were little, you understood that your primary caregiver, usually the mother, sometimes it's the father or someone else, but the, that at least one person was always there for you.

Like, not like they didn't take a shower sometimes and you were, were crying in the crib and, you know, I'm not talking about that.

But just generally speaking, you knew that they've got your back and that they told you the truth, so they didn't sneak out on you, as small as that sounds.

Um, they were there for you.

They, you could count on them.

Yeah.

That would be Dr. Aliza Pressman, who's a developmental psychologist and a podcast host and also a parent who's constantly talking to other parents about Raising Kids in the Age of AI and said she felt like she needed better answers.

I'm in a position where parents are asking me about this constantly, but I don't...

You know, sometimes you don't know what you don't know.

So there have been things that I didn't even know I needed to be either worried or excited about.

Well, Dr. Aliza mentioned one program in particular that gave me some hope for how education might be powered by, rather than corroded by, AI.

There is a course being taught at, I believe, Tulane University, which was leaning into the fact that the students, of course, are using AI.

So, let's show them how they can use AI and then question it and question themselves and question each other to show that they understand the material.

Mm.

... how we grew, how we came to be who we are, and how we're growing others is kind of at the center of everything, in my view.

And I think that the science of parent- of the parent-child relationship is extraordinary and it's inspiring.

And it is overwhelmingly easier to get it, like, quote-unquote right.

And I think that that is game-changing, that there's- there's stuff that you can do that will change the relationships in your life, and that they're very easy to take on.

There's so much information out there about how to do every single thing, but the- the science itself is quite generous with parents, is such a beautiful experience.

Like, once you really buy into that, you have actionable steps that you can take that can be game-changing in your relationships, but they're not, like, this overwhelming, unattainable goal.

Mm.

It's great.

Thank you.

It says nothing revolutionary.

It's just, like, how I translated the research, but it's all kind of...

What I think is cool is there's some pretty big stuff that we know to be true about what makes a healthy relationship, and it's reflection, like being able to kind of pause for a second and think, like, "What does this moment mean for me with this human that I'm interacting with, and, like, what's it bringing up for me?" Sometimes I'm not responding to the child.

I'm responding to my own stuff, and this is true in romantic relationships and friendships and everything.

So just reflection and pause, and then regulation, just co-regulating in a relationship, knowing that your nervous system and their nervous system are connected, and, like, again, more often than not, that you have access to saying, like, "It's not an emergency.

If you're an orchid, like I am, and then you have an orchid, what's your, what is your advice?

Mm-hmm.

Then your kids trust you a little bit more, and the relationship is stronger.

But I think the key with discipline is not being afraid of how our kids react to it and having the strength of purpose and belief that if they do have a negative reaction to it, we can love them all the way through it, but we're not gonna change our minds about it.

'Cause that's where it gets messy, is that if we're talking all about how important the relationship is, and then you have this limit that you set, like this is my expectation of you, and your child doesn't like it, the s- simply like I, you know, I take the phone away at night or the iPad or whatever, [sighs] and your child is freaking out about it, then you go, "Well, now I've messed with the relationship, and so I guess I should...

They're crying and I need to, like, get back in there.

So okay, I'll give you more time," or whatever it is.

And that's where we get confused.

Mm.