I think that'll give a nice departure point for us to then consider where we are today.

today.Yeah, exactly.

Um, this is why the subtitles were important for me and Jan until we finally forced ourselves to give up on the subtitles.

So Process and Event, our sixth book, is the first book that doesn't have a subtitle.

[laughs] But Digital Libido did.

Digital Libido, the fifth book, which came out in twenty eighteen, has the subtitle Sex, Power, and Violence in the Networked Society.

And why do we talk about sex, power, and violence? Because sex, power, and violence are constants.

So would you like to clarify anything in there now I've spoken for a bit?

And I really want to speak to where I think we are meeting each other today, which cannot define itself so cleanly with respect to what tribes we belong to.

It's true.

This is spot on because we all feel the membranes are too weak right now.

And they're compensated for with people being fanatical.

Okay, so for example, if I become a fanatical Islamist rather than a Muslim, it means that I don't believe in Allah any longer and I compensate for my lack of belief by going over the top.

So in our work, what we discovered when we're doing, okay, so we're doing a lot of anthropology in parallel with the philosophy.

We try to keep them separate, but it's also strengthening the arguments.

Well, I'm obviously particularly interested, not only in how we can coordinate ourselves to the grand long-term horizons let's say of beyond that but also very much now and so how do you see then attentionalism as it's showing up today and what do you mean by the difference between an attention economy and then you used another word there the only thing i'll add is just that there does you know one uh dynamic that appears to be uh present in both or maybe it enacts perhaps in different ways is scarcity scarcity is still something that functions with import in our present economy and there is also a scarcity of attention

This is why the social media also fosters this idea that there's a continuity in us.

In Jung, this is called individuality, but we just call it dividuality because we're talking about very social beings.

In my work, we don't even use the word individual.

I think it's actually...

It's kind of individual was invented by people to put them in prisons and hold them responsible for things, and I don't wanna go there.

So we call them, we call each other dividuals.

Mm-hmm.

East Asian philosophy, um, Steve, uh, Graham Priest invented the term.