Aug 12, 2026 · 1 hr 11 min · 11 segments
Liberal values and institutions now face aggressive challenges from both right and left extremism, so how should defenders of the embattled liberal center respond? It's become clear now that the…
Brink LindseyHost
Jonathan RauchGuest
So there's, there's two kind of separate questions, and I, I hope we'll have time to get to both time horizons.
Uh, but so first, and the, the, the one that's more acute and gets temperatures, you know, more elevated is, you know, how should liberals react to this current political crisis, the backlash from left and right extremes? There's a second question, which really my book was more aimed at, which is, how is liberal society doing more broadly, and where does liberal society go from here? What is the path of liberal progress and growth? So, you know, issue one is about how to beat the bad guys and keep liberalism going.
The second time horizon, the broader, the longer view is about the direction liberal society ought to be going in.
What I call the permanent problem is gonna stay here even if we solve the, the current, you know, political distempers.
The challenge of translating mass prosperity into mass flourishing will still be with us.
So, uh, I see the, in, in that second bigger view, I see the, the Crisis of politics that we're through now is just one element of it's embellishing and making more difficult deeper underlying issues.
And this, you know, you, you said you're a, you're a fox and you're a journalist by training and you see details and so I'm, uh, I don't know what I am by training, uh, but, uh, but what I've wound up figuring out is that I specialize in generalizing.
... are, uh, big picture narratives where I try to see some pattern in events that isn't what everybody else is saying and, and try to help us understand the details through presenting them in a new frame.
As I've gotten older, I've become, I've, I've become more and more convinced that our sort of ideological knee jerks have a lot to do with our personality.
Uh, that what we think are, is kind of, you know, very carefully thought out intellection, a lot of it is just, you know, who we are being expressed on political questions.
And so, uh, it could be that a, a, you know, a, some of our differences here are just personality differences that my sweeping broad, uh, statements rub you r- the wrong way as, you know, under sourced.
And perhaps, you know, I am frustrated at your lack of being able to see the same big picture I see.
So it, it could be that, you know, rather than substantive disagreements about specific X, Y, and Z, we just have kind of different ways of looking at things that, uh, that, you know-
That said, over the years, I think we've known each other 20 plus years, and I've learned a lot from your style without, without being able to take it on board as, as my own.
And, um, let me try something that, that might be helpful, which is to try to explain what I think I'm learning from the work that you and others are doing as it-
So there's, there's two kind of separate questions, and I, I hope we'll have time to get to both time horizons.
Uh, but so first, and the, the, the one that's more acute and gets temperatures, you know, more elevated is, you know, how should liberals react to this current political crisis, the backlash from left and right extremes? There's a second question, which really my book was more aimed at, which is, how is liberal society doing more broadly, and where does liberal society go from here? What is the path of liberal progress and growth? So, you know, issue one is about how to beat the bad guys and keep liberalism going.
The second time horizon, the broader, the longer view is about the direction liberal society ought to be going in.
What I call the permanent problem is gonna stay here even if we solve the, the current, you know, political distempers.
The challenge of translating mass prosperity into mass flourishing will still be with us.
So, uh, I see the, in, in that second bigger view, I see the, the Crisis of politics that we're through now is just one element of it's embellishing and making more difficult deeper underlying issues.
And this, you know, you, you said you're a, you're a fox and you're a journalist by training and you see details and so I'm, uh, I don't know what I am by training, uh, but, uh, but what I've wound up figuring out is that I specialize in generalizing.
... are, uh, big picture narratives where I try to see some pattern in events that isn't what everybody else is saying and, and try to help us understand the details through presenting them in a new frame.
As I've gotten older, I've become, I've, I've become more and more convinced that our sort of ideological knee jerks have a lot to do with our personality.
Uh, that what we think are, is kind of, you know, very carefully thought out intellection, a lot of it is just, you know, who we are being expressed on political questions.
And so, uh, it could be that a, a, you know, a, some of our differences here are just personality differences that my sweeping broad, uh, statements rub you r- the wrong way as, you know, under sourced.
And perhaps, you know, I am frustrated at your lack of being able to see the same big picture I see.
So it, it could be that, you know, rather than substantive disagreements about specific X, Y, and Z, we just have kind of different ways of looking at things that, uh, that, you know-
That said, over the years, I think we've known each other 20 plus years, and I've learned a lot from your style without, without being able to take it on board as, as my own.
And, um, let me try something that, that might be helpful, which is to try to explain what I think I'm learning from the work that you and others are doing as it-
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