Jul 11, 2026 · 53 min · 13 segments
John Ellis talks with The New York Times reporters Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan about their book, *Regime Change*, an account of Donald Trump’s second presidency. They discuss how power operates…
Jonathan SwanGuest
Maggie HabermanGuest
John EllisHost
Had 230,000 votes gone the other way in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania, Kamala Harris would have received 270 electoral votes and would have been elected president of the United States.
Trump describes this as one of the greatest, if not the greatest, landslide in American political history.
Does he believe that, or is that just... a way of positioning himself as more powerful than he in fact might be.
I think there's a very long history of him saying everything that he does at which he succeeds, or frankly, even the things he doesn't, are a massive success.
He had this line in the 90s when he was giving someone a tour of of Mar-a-Lago.
And he was saying something like that, you know, we have that we want a competition for the best doors or something like that.
And he said to the person, the word the best is very, the phrase the best is very important to me.
What I do think it is, is him underlining the fact that, I mean, look, he was the first Republican to win the the popular vote in 20 years.
You know, his last one was two in 2016, but he did not win the popular vote and it was under a cloud of investigations.
Had 230,000 votes gone the other way in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania, Kamala Harris would have received 270 electoral votes and would have been elected president of the United States.
Trump describes this as one of the greatest, if not the greatest, landslide in American political history.
Does he believe that, or is that just... a way of positioning himself as more powerful than he in fact might be.
I think there's a very long history of him saying everything that he does at which he succeeds, or frankly, even the things he doesn't, are a massive success.
He had this line in the 90s when he was giving someone a tour of of Mar-a-Lago.
And he was saying something like that, you know, we have that we want a competition for the best doors or something like that.
And he said to the person, the word the best is very, the phrase the best is very important to me.
What I do think it is, is him underlining the fact that, I mean, look, he was the first Republican to win the the popular vote in 20 years.
You know, his last one was two in 2016, but he did not win the popular vote and it was under a cloud of investigations.
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