Sep 1, 2026 · 53 min · 11 segments
What kind of leader do you need to become when knowledge and experience alone are no longer enough? In this episode of the Mark Divine Show, I sit down with Amy Elizabeth Fox to explore the deeper…
Mark DivineHost
Amy Elizabeth FoxGuest
Peak performers, and especially in the business world, they trade connection for performance, right? Because you said they're externally referent, they're looking for wins, big exit for their company or, right, the CEO title or whatever, whatever points on the board they're putting.
And so because they're all externally referent, they're missing, right, that connection.
I do one module in my programs where I ask people to make a rigorous inventory of all the ways they numb themselves.
Everything from over-committing, over-helping, over-responsible, overworking, to, you know, extreme sports, to news addiction, to pornography, to many, many things.
And then I ask them a second list, which is, why would we talk about this in a leadership program? Like, what's the cost to you, your relationships, and your contribution of this numbing? And then you can hear a pin drop because people start naming just what you said.
I'm doing the same thing I've always done, but it's not innovative in any way.
And if they aren't facilitated to look, they'll go to their deathbed like that.
So you've kind of alluded to, I think, the master skill for leaders going forward is basically to slow down and be still.
Peak performers, and especially in the business world, they trade connection for performance, right? Because you said they're externally referent, they're looking for wins, big exit for their company or, right, the CEO title or whatever, whatever points on the board they're putting.
And so because they're all externally referent, they're missing, right, that connection.
I do one module in my programs where I ask people to make a rigorous inventory of all the ways they numb themselves.
Everything from over-committing, over-helping, over-responsible, overworking, to, you know, extreme sports, to news addiction, to pornography, to many, many things.
And then I ask them a second list, which is, why would we talk about this in a leadership program? Like, what's the cost to you, your relationships, and your contribution of this numbing? And then you can hear a pin drop because people start naming just what you said.
I'm doing the same thing I've always done, but it's not innovative in any way.
And if they aren't facilitated to look, they'll go to their deathbed like that.
So you've kind of alluded to, I think, the master skill for leaders going forward is basically to slow down and be still.
Every episode on Radar is fully transcribed, speaker-labeled, and rich with metadata. Here is a taste of this one. Try Radar for free to see the rest.
3 of 11
Inner Skills for the AI Age
Chaos demands capabilities beyond knowledge and expertise.
The Lake of Uncried Tears
Many people carry pain they never learned to release.
The Cost of Never Stopping
Constant productivity can hide an exhausting lifelong pattern.
+8 more clips · 8 min 29 sec of audio in all
7 of 25
The rest of this transcript — segmented and speaker-labeled, so you land on the exact moment something was said
All 11 clips — the highlight moments, each cut as its own audio, with a title and a speaker
All 11 segments — the transcript broken into labeled sections, every ad read marked
All 25 topics — jump to every other episode discussing the same subject
Every related episode — other shows Radar links to this one
No account is needed to search Radar.
