Episode 065 – From Shift Work to Ketamine Clinic: What Actually Changes with Dr. Nico Grundmann (Soundbites from the Vault)

So when you hire an emergency physician or a clinician, someone who's used to working in the ER, and like for me, I noticed that when I was doing both, like there's a, I have to like shift gears.

So sometimes when I'm working in the ER, I'm like, I'm in fifth gear, I'm cruising, I'm seeing a ton of patients.

But at the clinic, when I'm seeing patients there, I have to really slow down.

So what advice do you give to a clinician that you're going to hire and say, hey, this is what's different about the way we do it versus in the emergency department?

Yeah, there's in some ways EM physicians, anesthesiologists, they're really good for this work and that they have a core set of skills.

And in some ways it's actually a little bit of a mismatch for them too.

It's the same way that a psychiatrist needs retraining about some things to do this.

So does an EM provider.

So does an anesthesiologist or an ICU doc.

The biggest things that we concentrate on for the docs who join our team, some of them are just like normal lives.

Like, hey, this is Monday through Friday.

This is not shift work.

And that is different.

In some ways, you actually kind of are on call.

It's not that your patient's going to text you at midnight and you're responsible for that.

We make really clear that we're part of a larger team.

The psychiatrist is still there, etc., But this isn't a role where you clock out and you're done.

That's a really big mental model shift for a lot of docs.

EM, you finish your shift, somebody else comes in and they're responsible and you get to go home.

With this work, you have the people you take care of.

There are longitudinal relationships.

You get to really know people.

That has enormous value and feels just really nice to be able to kind of see somebody progress or have a depression to being super functional.

We get cards from people who have their weddings after treatment, who are able to rebuild their lives and kind of reclaim who they used to be prior to their depression.

And seeing that is just a real privilege.

So when you hire an emergency physician or a clinician, someone who's used to working in the ER, and like for me, I noticed that when I was doing both, like there's a, I have to like shift gears.

So sometimes when I'm working in the ER, I'm like, I'm in fifth gear, I'm cruising, I'm seeing a ton of patients.

But at the clinic, when I'm seeing patients there, I have to really slow down.

So what advice do you give to a clinician that you're going to hire and say, hey, this is what's different about the way we do it versus in the emergency department?

Yeah, there's in some ways EM physicians, anesthesiologists, they're really good for this work and that they have a core set of skills.

And in some ways it's actually a little bit of a mismatch for them too.

It's the same way that a psychiatrist needs retraining about some things to do this.

So does an EM provider.

So does an anesthesiologist or an ICU doc.

The biggest things that we concentrate on for the docs who join our team, some of them are just like normal lives.

Like, hey, this is Monday through Friday.

This is not shift work.

And that is different.

In some ways, you actually kind of are on call.

It's not that your patient's going to text you at midnight and you're responsible for that.

We make really clear that we're part of a larger team.

The psychiatrist is still there, etc., But this isn't a role where you clock out and you're done.

That's a really big mental model shift for a lot of docs.

EM, you finish your shift, somebody else comes in and they're responsible and you get to go home.

With this work, you have the people you take care of.

There are longitudinal relationships.

You get to really know people.

That has enormous value and feels just really nice to be able to kind of see somebody progress or have a depression to being super functional.

We get cards from people who have their weddings after treatment, who are able to rebuild their lives and kind of reclaim who they used to be prior to their depression.

And seeing that is just a real privilege.