The Chick Report with Dr. Sandra Glahn
Aug 25, 2026 · 41 min · 10 segments
What happens when the place meant for healing becomes the place of harm? In this episode of The Chick Report, Dr. Sandra Glahn talks with Dr. Scot McKnight about trauma in the church, why so many…
Scott McKnightGuest
Sandra GlahnHost
Um, at Northern Seminary, I had a master's, uh, I directed a masters in New Testament.
And I was very lenient [chuckles] with students, you know, of what they wanted to study, and I always said, "I want you to write as if this is gonna be a readable book rather than don't write as if you're writing an academic journal article." So we worked on writing skills so we could communicate to the church.
And I had some wonderful theses, a lot of them, but one, uh, thesis really stood out to me.
Uh, it was by Adrian Gibson, who's a trauma therapist and had gone to Denver Seminary, and I'm not sure what degree she got.
But she's been a trauma therapist for about 20 years in Phoenix, and she wrote a thesis on trauma in the New Testament, mostly about trauma and what it is.
And I, as I was reading it, um, I was reading it upstairs in my back room, and I said to Chris, my wife, who's a psychologist, I said, "This book needs to be pu- this thesis needs to be published because it's so clear on what trauma is, and it's exactly what churches need to be aware of because they are not aware of what trauma is." And there are some silly people who say trauma is woke, and, uh, it's just, it's sad.
So, um, it was a nice idea to publish it, but I knew that Adrian on her own would have a hard time getting it published.
And so I, I said, "I, I wanna help you out somehow." And it was in reading her thesis and then writing the everyday Bible study on 2 Corinthians, uh, in the Zondervan, what is it? HarperChristian Resources, I think it's called, that I came across a passage in 2 Corinthians 10-13 where I said, "Paul was traumatized by the Corinthians," whoever, whoever they were, you know? We don't know exactly.
And I started digging around, and I find a, a, a really good, uh, article, academic study by a professor in San Francisco, I think, uh, last name was Clark, who studied, who, who has a degree in psychology and in biblical studies or theology.
So he was competent as a biblical scholar, and he came to the conclusion, the diagnosis that Paul had PTSD, uh, on the basis of the Corinthian correspondence, and I thought, "Exactly." So here's what I did.
I, uh, I was asked by an English publisher that does booklets, you know, short booklets, to write something on this.
And I, I wrote to the editor and I said, "How, how many words do I have?" He said, "Maximum 8,000." [laughs] I said, "I've got 21,000 words.
There's no way I can do this in, in 8,000 words." So I pulled the plug on that, and I told Adrian, "I've got, I've got something that I can contribute to this book." And so we worked with Zondervan Reflective and, um, they a- they gave us a pro- you know, they gave us a contract.
And then we had quite a bit of work to do to combine trauma therapy with Paul.
Uh, but, but we worked it together, and in the process, we found and came up with and listened to stories, mostly of church leaders who had been traumatized by congregations or people in the church, church-- Christians wounding other Christians.
Um, at Northern Seminary, I had a master's, uh, I directed a masters in New Testament.
And I was very lenient [chuckles] with students, you know, of what they wanted to study, and I always said, "I want you to write as if this is gonna be a readable book rather than don't write as if you're writing an academic journal article." So we worked on writing skills so we could communicate to the church.
And I had some wonderful theses, a lot of them, but one, uh, thesis really stood out to me.
Uh, it was by Adrian Gibson, who's a trauma therapist and had gone to Denver Seminary, and I'm not sure what degree she got.
But she's been a trauma therapist for about 20 years in Phoenix, and she wrote a thesis on trauma in the New Testament, mostly about trauma and what it is.
And I, as I was reading it, um, I was reading it upstairs in my back room, and I said to Chris, my wife, who's a psychologist, I said, "This book needs to be pu- this thesis needs to be published because it's so clear on what trauma is, and it's exactly what churches need to be aware of because they are not aware of what trauma is." And there are some silly people who say trauma is woke, and, uh, it's just, it's sad.
So, um, it was a nice idea to publish it, but I knew that Adrian on her own would have a hard time getting it published.
And so I, I said, "I, I wanna help you out somehow." And it was in reading her thesis and then writing the everyday Bible study on 2 Corinthians, uh, in the Zondervan, what is it? HarperChristian Resources, I think it's called, that I came across a passage in 2 Corinthians 10-13 where I said, "Paul was traumatized by the Corinthians," whoever, whoever they were, you know? We don't know exactly.
And I started digging around, and I find a, a, a really good, uh, article, academic study by a professor in San Francisco, I think, uh, last name was Clark, who studied, who, who has a degree in psychology and in biblical studies or theology.
So he was competent as a biblical scholar, and he came to the conclusion, the diagnosis that Paul had PTSD, uh, on the basis of the Corinthian correspondence, and I thought, "Exactly." So here's what I did.
I, uh, I was asked by an English publisher that does booklets, you know, short booklets, to write something on this.
And I, I wrote to the editor and I said, "How, how many words do I have?" He said, "Maximum 8,000." [laughs] I said, "I've got 21,000 words.
There's no way I can do this in, in 8,000 words." So I pulled the plug on that, and I told Adrian, "I've got, I've got something that I can contribute to this book." And so we worked with Zondervan Reflective and, um, they a- they gave us a pro- you know, they gave us a contract.
And then we had quite a bit of work to do to combine trauma therapy with Paul.
Uh, but, but we worked it together, and in the process, we found and came up with and listened to stories, mostly of church leaders who had been traumatized by congregations or people in the church, church-- Christians wounding other Christians.
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