Psychotherapy and Applied Psychology
May 26, 2026 · 45 min · 13 segments
Dr. Stevan Lars Nielsen -- a Clinical Professor and psychologist at Brigham Young University, jointly affiliated with Counseling Psychology and Special Education and Counseling and Psychological…
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One of the things that you said was that, and even the motivation, uh, for that first, um, uh, article that you talked about was that in our training programs, the faculty psychologists, that they're sort of, uh, leaning away from re- religiosity.
Um, but and I think that's still the case, and, uh, so, so one of the questions I have is, so, uh, you know, I think lots of therapists don't bring up religion with their clients because they're nervous and they feel like they don't know what to do, or they're not competent to talk about it, or they don't ha- When you talk to folks about these sorts of things who are in these situations, what do you tell them?
Well, I, I'll just say, "Are you religious? Are you a believer?" That's all I say.
"Do you wanna talk about it?" And if they do wanna talk about it, then I join in with them, you know? If they don't wanna talk about it, as far as they can tell from that moment on, I'm an agnostic or atheist.
Now, if they ask me directly, "Are you a believer?" I would say, "Yes, I am." But you know what? Not many people ask.
I would say that less than 20 times out of the thousands and thousands and thousands of clients I've treated has anybody asked me directly.
And I will go two or three years here at BYU without anybody asking me.
Now, BYU, of course, most individuals here have to, have to abide by a code of ethics and a, an honor code, and they have to actually tell their religious leader...
Well, you know that.
You were here.
They have to tell their religious leader that they're practicing, that they're f- you know, they believe, right? Now, we have a larger percentage of our clients who would not say they believe.
But after they've been here for three or four years, or even two years, they've got credits they wanna protect.
[chuckles] They don't wanna leave and have credits they can't transfer and graduate.
So I have a fair number of clients that are no longer believing, but they don't ask me.
When they, when they say they've got this or that problem, I just sort of join in with them and talk about the problem.
They s- nobody has...
At BYU, nobody has to come to Counseling and Psychological Services to hear about religion, right? They just turn to the person right or n- right or left of them, and they'll have somebody who'll preach to them.
Not me.
It's not gonna be me.
I don't never preach to clients.
I would never do that.
Although, if they're religion, if they're religious, if they're believers, then I would say, "Okay, well, you, you've told me you're a believer, so you believe in the Book of Mormon, you believe in the Bible?" And if they say yes, then I can point out things that are in the Bible or the Book of Mormon that are relevant to rationally emotive behavior therapy.
I would not say, "Hey, what you're doing here is a sin." No, I'd never say that.
I'd never do anything like that.
I might say, "Look what you're doing here, I don't think it fits anything that's sin according to your religious beliefs." But I would never say, "Look what you're doing here is a sin." That's just not my job, and I don't think anybody comes wanting that, and I don't think they'd be confused about that either.
One of the things that you said was that, and even the motivation, uh, for that first, um, uh, article that you talked about was that in our training programs, the faculty psychologists, that they're sort of, uh, leaning away from re- religiosity.
Um, but and I think that's still the case, and, uh, so, so one of the questions I have is, so, uh, you know, I think lots of therapists don't bring up religion with their clients because they're nervous and they feel like they don't know what to do, or they're not competent to talk about it, or they don't ha- When you talk to folks about these sorts of things who are in these situations, what do you tell them?
Well, I, I'll just say, "Are you religious? Are you a believer?" That's all I say.
"Do you wanna talk about it?" And if they do wanna talk about it, then I join in with them, you know? If they don't wanna talk about it, as far as they can tell from that moment on, I'm an agnostic or atheist.
Now, if they ask me directly, "Are you a believer?" I would say, "Yes, I am." But you know what? Not many people ask.
I would say that less than 20 times out of the thousands and thousands and thousands of clients I've treated has anybody asked me directly.
And I will go two or three years here at BYU without anybody asking me.
Now, BYU, of course, most individuals here have to, have to abide by a code of ethics and a, an honor code, and they have to actually tell their religious leader...
Well, you know that.
You were here.
They have to tell their religious leader that they're practicing, that they're f- you know, they believe, right? Now, we have a larger percentage of our clients who would not say they believe.
But after they've been here for three or four years, or even two years, they've got credits they wanna protect.
[chuckles] They don't wanna leave and have credits they can't transfer and graduate.
So I have a fair number of clients that are no longer believing, but they don't ask me.
When they, when they say they've got this or that problem, I just sort of join in with them and talk about the problem.
They s- nobody has...
At BYU, nobody has to come to Counseling and Psychological Services to hear about religion, right? They just turn to the person right or n- right or left of them, and they'll have somebody who'll preach to them.
Not me.
It's not gonna be me.
I don't never preach to clients.
I would never do that.
Although, if they're religion, if they're religious, if they're believers, then I would say, "Okay, well, you, you've told me you're a believer, so you believe in the Book of Mormon, you believe in the Bible?" And if they say yes, then I can point out things that are in the Bible or the Book of Mormon that are relevant to rationally emotive behavior therapy.
I would not say, "Hey, what you're doing here is a sin." No, I'd never say that.
I'd never do anything like that.
I might say, "Look what you're doing here, I don't think it fits anything that's sin according to your religious beliefs." But I would never say, "Look what you're doing here is a sin." That's just not my job, and I don't think anybody comes wanting that, and I don't think they'd be confused about that either.
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