Let's Talk Forensic Psychology
Aug 3, 2026 · 58 min · 12 segments
We were joined by Dr Ken Logan, licensed clinical psychologist and professor of clinical psychology at George Fox University, to discuss moral injury and harm.Having trained clinicians internationally…
Ken LoganGuestGeraldine AkermanHostEmily JonesHostWe always start our episodes, um, with asking people how they got into their line of work.
Um, well, early on in my clinical work, I gradually found myself noticing that a lot of people that I worked with were, uh...
And this, these are only mostly trauma clients, folks dealing with trauma, traumatic, um, conditions, that they were suffering in ways that are, uh, traditional diagnostic framing and some of the trauma models that I was taught in grad school, that they didn't really fully explain.
Uh, some people weren't primarily terrified or dealing with, uh, fear-based kind of issues.
Um, they were bringing in a lot of feelings of deep, profound shame or moral conflicts they were in.
A lot of folks dealing with feelings of betrayal or spiritual disorientation, or struggling with big questions about their identity or their w- uh, meaning making, trust, uh, struggles with their conscience, these kinds of things.
So folks I was working with, like first responders and helping professionals, and, uh, people in ministry work, and even forensic populations, that it, it was, it was everywhere.
So over time, it kind of became clear that a lot of the people were wrestling, not with fear or danger, but with moral or more relational kinds of wounds.
Um, and what, uh, really what led me into the research and writing on the topic was, what came later for me was a personal experience of moral injury, uh, resulting from a very significant betrayal from a former therapist that I saw when I was in my graduate training.
And that felt experience really led me into my own recovery and to a desire to help others going through the same experience.
So that eventually led me into the study of moral injury and what then led to writing, uh, the book, Trust Wounds.
And, um, I became increasingly interested in how those experiences, um, affect human beings psychologically and relationally and spiritually.
Everybody talks about this stuff, but it's, it was kind of missed and bypassed as a legitimate mental health need.
And, um, that kind of got my motivation up and got me focused on studying it, wanting to understand more about it.
Um, it's always, it's, it's, it's fascinating to me, I think moral injury is a term that potentially, probably the last year I'd say, Jo, has been, uh, we've been using a lot more.
But like you just said, it's such a common human experience, and also one that in the, our line of work that we so often feel.
We always start our episodes, um, with asking people how they got into their line of work.
Um, well, early on in my clinical work, I gradually found myself noticing that a lot of people that I worked with were, uh...
And this, these are only mostly trauma clients, folks dealing with trauma, traumatic, um, conditions, that they were suffering in ways that are, uh, traditional diagnostic framing and some of the trauma models that I was taught in grad school, that they didn't really fully explain.
Uh, some people weren't primarily terrified or dealing with, uh, fear-based kind of issues.
Um, they were bringing in a lot of feelings of deep, profound shame or moral conflicts they were in.
A lot of folks dealing with feelings of betrayal or spiritual disorientation, or struggling with big questions about their identity or their w- uh, meaning making, trust, uh, struggles with their conscience, these kinds of things.
So folks I was working with, like first responders and helping professionals, and, uh, people in ministry work, and even forensic populations, that it, it was, it was everywhere.
So over time, it kind of became clear that a lot of the people were wrestling, not with fear or danger, but with moral or more relational kinds of wounds.
Um, and what, uh, really what led me into the research and writing on the topic was, what came later for me was a personal experience of moral injury, uh, resulting from a very significant betrayal from a former therapist that I saw when I was in my graduate training.
And that felt experience really led me into my own recovery and to a desire to help others going through the same experience.
So that eventually led me into the study of moral injury and what then led to writing, uh, the book, Trust Wounds.
And, um, I became increasingly interested in how those experiences, um, affect human beings psychologically and relationally and spiritually.
Everybody talks about this stuff, but it's, it was kind of missed and bypassed as a legitimate mental health need.
And, um, that kind of got my motivation up and got me focused on studying it, wanting to understand more about it.
Um, it's always, it's, it's, it's fascinating to me, I think moral injury is a term that potentially, probably the last year I'd say, Jo, has been, uh, we've been using a lot more.
But like you just said, it's such a common human experience, and also one that in the, our line of work that we so often feel.
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