Context with Sebenzile Nkambule
Sep 14, 2026 · 1 hr 29 min · 11 segments
**What can numbers tell us about who we are—and where we're going?** Former Statistician-General Dr Pali Lehohla has spent much of his career trying to make South Africa visible to itself. In this…
Pali LehohlaGuest
Sebenzile NkambuleHostHey folks, welcome to yet another installment of Context with Sebenzile Nkambule.
And as always, thank you to you who's subscribed, liked, commented and shared some of the episodes that we've had already.
And welcome you who hasn't done so just yet to join us on this wonderful journey that we are on.
And today we are asking the question, who counts, right? We're talking migration identity and the numbers that shape this beautiful country of ours and by extension, right? Other societies, other countries, the continent at large.
They are collected, they're interpreted, questioned, challenged, and sometimes, as we know, they are even politicized.
In South Africa today, very few issues generate this much heat and as little clarity as the issue of migration, population growth, service delivery, who belongs, what services are for whom, and...
Are they enough, right? And often the conversation is that they are not enough because we don't know who is around and who is in the country.
And in every election cycle, we hear claims about undocumented migrants, overwhelming hospitals, schools, and public services.
We hear debates about borders, citizenship, documentation, unemployment, as well as issues of crime.
I'm sure you've seen those clips yourself where Zimbabweans who have never left Zimbabwe are complaining about the returnees from South Africa have come back home to Zimbabwe and they are attributing new incidents of crime such as carjacking and the theft of cell phones.
They are attributing those to the Zimbabweans who have been living in South Africa for a while and have since come back home.
But those sort of conversations, the issues around economic opportunity or lack thereof, are indeed at the heart of the issues we're unpacking today, the issues of numbers, data, statistics.
So how much of what we believe is actually supported by evidence? Because before a government can build any school or any clinic, they need to know how many children need the classrooms right they need to know how many patients live in that community and so how many doctors and nurses and so on are then required for that and so we are asking who counts statistics are not just numbers on a spreadsheet they determine where roads are built how provinces are funded how businesses decide where to invest and how democracy understands itself today's guest, incredible, incredible person, who spent much of his career trying to answer these questions.
As South Africa's former statistician general, he helped shape the country's understanding of itself, not through opinion, but through evidence.
And today we're going to go beyond the headlines to explore how data shapes democracy, why stats matter to every South African and to everybody who is in the country, and what happens when politics overtakes evidence.
And today I'm very stoked and excited to be speaking to one Dr. Badi Lohotla, a legendary thought leader really in this country.
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Hey folks, welcome to yet another installment of Context with Sebenzile Nkambule.
And as always, thank you to you who's subscribed, liked, commented and shared some of the episodes that we've had already.
And welcome you who hasn't done so just yet to join us on this wonderful journey that we are on.
And today we are asking the question, who counts, right? We're talking migration identity and the numbers that shape this beautiful country of ours and by extension, right? Other societies, other countries, the continent at large.
They are collected, they're interpreted, questioned, challenged, and sometimes, as we know, they are even politicized.
In South Africa today, very few issues generate this much heat and as little clarity as the issue of migration, population growth, service delivery, who belongs, what services are for whom, and...
Are they enough, right? And often the conversation is that they are not enough because we don't know who is around and who is in the country.
And in every election cycle, we hear claims about undocumented migrants, overwhelming hospitals, schools, and public services.
We hear debates about borders, citizenship, documentation, unemployment, as well as issues of crime.
I'm sure you've seen those clips yourself where Zimbabweans who have never left Zimbabwe are complaining about the returnees from South Africa have come back home to Zimbabwe and they are attributing new incidents of crime such as carjacking and the theft of cell phones.
They are attributing those to the Zimbabweans who have been living in South Africa for a while and have since come back home.
But those sort of conversations, the issues around economic opportunity or lack thereof, are indeed at the heart of the issues we're unpacking today, the issues of numbers, data, statistics.
So how much of what we believe is actually supported by evidence? Because before a government can build any school or any clinic, they need to know how many children need the classrooms right they need to know how many patients live in that community and so how many doctors and nurses and so on are then required for that and so we are asking who counts statistics are not just numbers on a spreadsheet they determine where roads are built how provinces are funded how businesses decide where to invest and how democracy understands itself today's guest, incredible, incredible person, who spent much of his career trying to answer these questions.
As South Africa's former statistician general, he helped shape the country's understanding of itself, not through opinion, but through evidence.
And today we're going to go beyond the headlines to explore how data shapes democracy, why stats matter to every South African and to everybody who is in the country, and what happens when politics overtakes evidence.
And today I'm very stoked and excited to be speaking to one Dr. Badi Lohotla, a legendary thought leader really in this country.
