guardian going in the waiting room or the exam room and then and then if they are in the exam room super nervous super worried right like how could that negatively what do you do like thinking about the empathetic side of things as well so

So I personally think for cats and dogs, and this isn't just my experience, we actually have some research to back this up as well, which isn't surprising, but research is helpful, that the animals do better with their caregivers present, right? Mm-hmm.

You have to realize as veterinary professionals, like, take them to the back is something that we've been trained to do.

But let's be honest, like, when I lecture to vet professionals, I'm like, your kid's coming in for a routine vaccine.

The doctor just says we're going to take them to the back.

All of the parents cringe.

And I'm like... we're already kind of starting off on the wrong foot because narratives are created.

yeah

What is that, and how can trainers use this concept in their practice?

So I have this really cool resource, and I'm gonna look it up because Ryan knows my brain's a little broken 'cause I lost my cat last week.

Um, and this is where we're transparent with each other [laughs] 'cause my brain is...

But I have this really great resource, um, that really breaks it down better than I could right off the top of my head, but essentially...

I can't find it.

But essentially what it is, I don't have an organized computer.

Can anyone relate? Um, [laughs] but essentially what it is is it, it's a thing I do in my head, but I made kind of a resource for it where I take in who's on the caregiver team, like who's the animal's care team, what position do I have in that team, what's my scope within that team, how I can help within that team, and, like, for example, I did one with a caregiver who is a foster, so that makes it even more, right? So to be fair, that foster can't necessarily make medical choices.

Reason for teaching it?

We're not

really defining that.

And then also there are so many ways we can meet that animal's needs.

So there, cause you can say like orthopedic surgery, of course, rehab, mobility exercises are an important part of that.

But again, they have to be limited with their mobility.

In some contexts with surgeries, they may be limited to one area.

And instead of just saying, be quiet, can I give you a frozen Kong? Can I give you a snuffle mat? Can I teach you a hand target? You can happily learn how to touch your nose to my hand, which is also a great behavior for future stuff.

yeah,

So a lot of cat parents would say, like, "Well, how can I mimic that from the outside inside?" So what, what would you say to that?

That's a really great point, and I work with a lot of caregivers who have an idea of enrichment, and they think it's letting their cat outside, which that isn't the worst thing.

Obviously, it's case dependent.

We wanna consider the environment, and there's a lot of safe ways to allow your cat outside, like harness training for walks or catios.

I mean- The opportunities are endless, but there are so many ways for us to allow cats to kill things without...

I love mice and birds too, so there's a lot of toys that simulate birds.

Like, Da Bird is a classic one.

[laughs]