Symbolic system

And so it actually only really took me until I came to California that I realized that this childhood int- interest that I had actually was something that I could do as a career and, and make a whole living off of.

When I got to Stanford, I discovered that they had this degree program called Symbolic Systems, which only Stanford has, and it's kind of this little strange program that when I was there, I think per year they had about forty or fifty students, and now I think it's more than two hundred, so it's really grown, which is great.

What I loved about it is that it wasn't just computer science, which I was interested in, but it also included design, it included philosophy, it included psychology, and it was really...

You think about the idea of the program, it's not just to study computing, it's to study the, the, the whole context around why we build software.