about being kind of course we want to be kind but kindness alone you can be the kindest person in in that type of environment and it doesn't necessarily it might have an impact on me but it's not going to bring about that systemic change that is needed

I identify myself as a patient advocate and I do a lot of patient engagement consulting and I write a lot about the patient experience.

So I don't, I don't like speaking up.

I've written before about being a reluctant advocate.

I don't like conflict, but we have to, like we don't have a choice or your child is going to miss out on a lot.

So yeah, I think I learned that from Aaron, but then I got breast cancer nine years ago.

It's nine years since my diagnosis.