Special-purpose entity

But I don't know.

I mean, when we were reporting this, a lot of the ETFs wanted to hold one piece of SpaceX before SpaceX went public, whether through CapTable or SPV.

And then when SpaceX went public, they weren't so unique anymore.

So you would think that... like ETFs like this wouldn't crop up.

So what the hell are people doing buying the hyperscalers now? And think about it.

I mean, we don't really know how much SPV debt is out there.

I have heard that the number could be over a trillion dollars.

And understand, just because they're hiding it off their books doesn't mean they're not on the hook for it.

I'm just laughing.

It's like as we get more complicated and it's like these SPVs, it's...

Back to like nobody did anything wrong.

We are not accusing anyone of misdoing anything.

I don't remember the exact number.

So

with this background of what they went through with these SPVs in the past, as our kind of framework to think about, as of the beginning of October, SpaceX was reportedly in talks with Apollo and PIMCO to do a new $40 billion bond deal to raise money.

It was supposed to be $10 billion worth of bank loans and $30 billion worth of investment grade debt because

So it's a very similar concept.

I have to say, when I first came to BNY, because I wanted to be really close where the assets were, and everything, my whole career, BNY was involved in everything, whether or not I was at Citi doing derivatives, and of course, The SPV was at BNY or BNY was the cash agent or the trustee or whatever it was.

BNY was always something or the custodian when I was at other firms.

So it's sort of a facet.

But when we put it all in a fund and now we have a $100 million book, That gets the most attractive financing.

So sometimes the yields at the underlying asset level don't look as attractive because of the SPV level or property level debt.

But we know we're going to get 100, 150 basis point discount in interest and more loan proceeds because we're pooling it with a bunch of other assets.

Then that deal gets really attractive.

Hybrid infrastructure credits sit between traditional project finance and traditional corporate finance.

At the asset level, they can combine project finance features such as a ring-fenced SPV, contracted revenues, reserve accounts, security over assets and cash flows, and amortizing debt with corporate-style characteristics.

These can include exposure to completion, acquisition-oriented growth, flexibility to add or remove assets, and fewer restrictions on additional debt.

At the same time, they can also reflect a broader evolution from an individual asset to a portfolio or corporate platform.

And this is reset in such a way where the senior lender is taking about a 50% haircut on this thing.

I would love to know whether it's the same fund doing this, a different fund, or perhaps even an SPV where you just think, hey, we're coming back in on this thing at a great basis.

Because at $260 million, you can spend the millions of dollars you need and charge super low rents and undercut everybody else.

And that's really the business plan.