But in private equity, you tend to go a bit more exotic every now and then, and you can do a bit more different things, right? If we then think who receives equity in the private equity programs, is it broader, smaller? Are there any trends, anything you see there?

Yeah, that's a really interesting topic because I think that is one where you see things change over time.

So as long as I've been doing this job, it's always been used for very senior management and that makes sense.

You might have a management team that's been with a business a long time or a new management team that the PE house is bringing in over time and you need to incentivise them.

And they are clearly going to be some of your key people for getting towards an exit, which at least in the private equity, pure private equity environment is always the aim of the game.

A little bit different when you get into things like infrastructure funds where they might be holding for longer term.

But if we think of pure PE, always senior management.

First of all, why do companies do that? Can you avoid doing that if you want to? And how does that complicate the perceived value the way you think it