Right

... of my, uh, children, um, in DC And, um, you know, we just went through September 11th- Mm ... and, um, 25 years ago, it's incredible.

I moved to the United States on August 29th, 2001.

Gosh.

Oof.

Yeah.

And I was actually...

"Dana."

Yes,

and I think he was the editor of the Journal of Law and Economics for well over a decade.

I mean, he had many, many roles in his academic and non-academic life.

And as I said, I met him, I think, only like six months before he died.

But it was one of my favorite days at the Institute of Economic Affairs.

He came through and I mentioned the Lighthouse paper and how it affected me.

And that was well over 30, I think it was 33 years ago, 30, maybe 30 more, 35 years.

Especially elite school is like 40%, I think.

So why don't you just outline a, a few of the biggest failures as you see them from the World Health Organization during that period?

I think the largest failure of the WHO is actually the si-- a similar or same failure of many nation states around the world.

And that is they didn't follow through with the playbook they had in place.

I'm not a virologist, but if you speak to anybody who knows about coronaviruses, they tell you that over time, they become less lethal and more transmissible.

And hence, vaccines against them, whilst useful, uh, in principle, are going to be limited in practice.

So the first thing was to throw the playbook out, which is to help those who are most, most affected.

And when it came to COVID, it was those with comorbidities, those who are obese, and certainly those who are older.

Um, if a future administration wanted to re-engage, and I'm guessing that the, the Democrats would commit to re-entering the WHO, uh, how would you advise them on going about trying to build something genuinely better? If you just had, you know, a couple of minutes in a room with a Democratic, uh, presidential candidate, you know, what would you say that was the kind of key thing that they should be looking for to kind of, uh, extract to some sort of concession or, or a reform that was, you know, uh, non-negotiable if they were looking to re-enter the WHO?