Phil Judd

I can only imagine how isolated you would've felt growing up as an artist in Auckland in the 1960s.

And I think that what that gave Noel and s- other founders of the band, Rob Gillies and, and, and Phil Judd, I think it sort of gave them carte blanche to be whatever they wanted to be.

And what surprised me when I first started talking to Noel was I was asking those sort of questions, you know, "So where did this come? Where did that come from?" And the answer was always pretty much, "I don't know.

We just wanted to do something different." There's an early chapter in the book where Noel talks about just the, uh, the Clear Pacific light, as they call it, of New Zealand.

Yeah.

But it was Phil Judd and...

I can't remember that

story because there is a story about those two brothers.

[laughs]

I was like, "Oh, I just move the D chord up and down." And, um, I believe, uh, that guitar solo, um, was written by Phil Judd at some previous era of Split Enz, and Neil Finn stole it and put it into this song.

He was, he was repeating someone else's history [laughs]-

Yes

It is interesting.

I think at least two others, Phil Judd and Rob Gillies, were all at art school at the same time.

And does that explain something about the way you collectively broke ground visually as a

band? Well, I think...