Is it still litigation?

Yeah.

No, no, no, no. Jay was really good about it.

No, it was that Kesey, you know, was kind of, well, he really enjoyed that stuff that comes in the diplomatic pouch from Peru.

And, you know, I never got the joke about that stuff.

I just like, I get, my nose would just run and nothing would happen.

And I was like, what? Who cares? But back then people would be giving us things and um so I got some of that stuff and I you know I wasn't going to use it or anything and but uh he's like hey you know I could use that and I said okay but you know what do you got and he goes like well and I got some of this 1968 Owsley liquid if you know what I'm talking about and I said really he says yeah it's in the freezer right now it's the last of it I said okay you got a deal so we we traded and then um we were doing uh i think we were opening for them at the oakland coliseum and it was um i said to the guys hey you know after the show let's do this owsley stuff and so we uh did our part and then we partook of the Owsley and man it was just fantastic we hardly ever watched a concert because we weren't really that much into the dead but you know that was super cool but then the concert was over but Owsley was still talking to us and it turned out that our bus Mr.

Would you explain that to the listeners and then explain sort of maybe where it came from?

[laughs]

... which we thought made sense back then, 'cause you could get rides and stuff.

And so it was me, Howard, and Randy, and three guys with, like, you know, couple of big duffle bags full of sickles and knives [laughs] and stuff.

We thought it made sense to just hitchhike.

Anyway, um, we hitchhiked and this VW Bug, I mean, van, uh, pulled over and it had two gals in it, and we got in, and it turned out the girl who was driving was, um, Mary Sullivan, the niece of the actual Ed Sullivan.

And Ed Sullivan's show was still happening in 1974.

It went on to 1975.

How, how do you sort of coordinate with all these people in different places to learn a show?

Were you doing street shows? Where were you doing these theatrical shows?

Well, the theatrical shows we did on campus.

Oh, okay.

So UC Santa Cruz is divided into a number of college, you know, campuses or colleges.

Like we were at Cal.

The next one, the one next to us is Stevenson.

It was kind of based around Cambridge-Oxford idea.

Man, cancel culture was long ago.