And everyone's talking about community at the moment, like defensible moats, um, real interaction again another combat to ai so again i love that i also love the fact like the you've gone the layer almost beneath who you sell to in anticipation they grow and get there i haven't actually heard anybody do that in another firm so that is a long game and i'll rate that that's cool nick

Yeah, well, I think a lot of it would be echoing what Tom's talked about, because as you say, what Tom and the team here at Revenue Shift have is that complete demand engine.

And for those of you who are trying to put what Tom talks about in buckets, for us, there are four things that you need to do when you are looking at that demand engine.

You need to generate awareness, which Tom touched on with the LinkedIn content.

You need to show credibility.

And I think, as Tom mentioned, testimonials are a massive way to do that, particularly video.

I've lost count of the amount of consultancies who, when I get in a room with them, we talk about testimonials.

And so for us, that won't be entertained for a long, long time.

i mean you're running an agency you probably you know i don't need to reveal rates and things like that but have you got some thoughts on like what overspending under spending looks like on brand on marketing for a boutique

Yeah, well, firstly, we're reassuringly expensive, Ben.

But I would I think to Ben's point, this is where one of the big things that we find we help all clients with.

And actually, it's something that as of this turn of this year was a prerequisite for working with us is our clients.

And if you're on this call, whether you're not a client of ours or you are, have to have CRMs and they have to use them.

And this is exactly to Ben's point is actually the customer acquisition cost in services and the equation of customer acquisition cost to lifetime value is phenomenally skewed in a good way.

Because I completely agree with you, Ben, if one client becomes $10 million, which that can happen.

It's also a really nice segue into the next topic conversation, which is like, if you are going to put your pounds and pence, your cents and your dollars into marketing and particularly around things like thought leadership content, marketing that's helping you differentiate, what's going to give you the biggest bang for buck? Nick, if you lead the response on this, so what kind of marketing activity should boutiques be doing more of like where do you sense that market opportunity exists but maybe firms are missing out because they're not just spending the time the effort in those areas