It was the Groundhog's Day of like... nap schedules, walk around the block, get home for, so I think, how are you, and obviously I've read the book, what are some of the things that you are trying to reframe about that pause that it actually is this catalyst to the

next chapter? Yeah, first of all, let me say, I think that we could also be wired differently in that moment of time.

We could have had different jobs, you know, before.

I always say, if I had loved what I did, previously, I would have had a very different experience.

I didn't.

I was like feeling like it was Groundhog's Day in my career.

And so I want to highlight that because there's a lot of different factors that influence someone's desire to make room in different ways for a family life.

I'm like, what's the opposite of downshift? When did you know it was time to start to do that?

How should a couple talk about the math without making it purely about the dollars and cents?

Well, I'm so glad you bring this up.

This is such a layered conversation because I think the first piece is to call out that one in three women today feel forced to pause because of the cost of childcare.

And 60% of women cite financial considerations.

So we ran a study called the American Mothers on Pause.

Survey in 2023 of 1,200 at-home parents and 1,000 members of the general population.

So those findings, I think, illuminated that for so long we've said stay-at-home motherhood or career breaks are a luxury.

Now, for a new parent who's taken a pause and maybe they know they eventually want to go back, what's something small that they can do today so that they're not starting from zero in a few years?

And I'd be really curious to know what your thoughts were on that.

Well, you know, I think I got a front row seat to it in part because, yes, I started this work in 2016, 2017.

I launched on January 10, 2017.

And, you know, there was an irony in running a platform about career pauses while I was on a career pause.

And so it was really about planting the seeds for this work.

But there were times, I mean, I wrote the one pager about what this book was going to be in 2018.

Because I was looking at the data and there was more and more data saying that women, especially millennial women, identified with motherhood in a much more significant way, meaning that they wanted motherhood to be a more significant part of their identity, except they were seeing the same thing about work.

So what do you say to the person who wants to entertain a pause but is really afraid of that financial crisis? burden or the idea that they might take a financial hit or that they just can't like where do we kind of help the person who just feels terribly stuck in the in-between of what to do

hit.

And you cannot sell without... a lot of enthusiasm.

And enthusiasm can be gleaned a couple ways, but a really easy way is through controversy.

So she is brilliant.

The second part, I think, also is the context we're operating in.

Because the moment of time we're in right now is a far cry from where I was in 2016 or 2017.

Right.

what did that how did what would you remove

You

know, the PowerPause started as such a small project with a really big idea 10 years ago.

I had my first son like you in 2016.

It was the height of the lean-in movement, the height of the girl boss era.

And I had him and there was something about rocking with him that just gave me this moment of, After so long of trying to climb in professional life, in social life, if I'm being honest, I just felt so at peace.

I felt like this kid didn't want me to be anything more than who I was.

And that felt freeing.

So I'm curious, like, what are you seeing there? You know, is that a failure on the part of corporate America for not creating more flexibility at work? Or is it just an example of how these women, you know, are able to really balance two things, you know, but in different ways than we expect them to?

Mm-hmm.

"And there is a value for the work that I'm contributing, paid or not paid, and in that way, we are interdependent." And the reason why it's so crucial to establish that is because then, later on, when you're saying, "Well, let's look at our budget for the year," do we as a system, do we as a household system benefit from actually having childcare, like maybe 15 hours of childcare to allow me breaks? And suddenly the conversation is not about, "Okay, well, I'm not working for pay, so I don't deserve help." It's, "What do we as a household want to do to invest our shared household income against values that are important to our family?" I think that level of safety and dignity comes from deciding that household income is shared no matter-

Mm-hmm

... that this reveals to me?" And so let's focus on the professional goal.

The professional goal suddenly was, "I wanna be able to write about women." And I had no experience doing that besides through the lens of a brand until then, but I had Squarespace available to me and Instagram available to me and a lot of naps and night times available to me.

So I broke that into, "Okay, I'm gonna write three blog posts a week and five Instagram posts a week." And that was the foundation of what obviously grew, but maybe someone else doesn't have as linear of a track, and they start to explore that.

Mm-hmm.

Because for so long we've been fed this black-and-white idea of stay at home and working, and I think the reason I don't resonate with the idea of stay at home is I think it's so much more fluid than that.

You know, the data shows that one in three women are planning a pause in the next two years.

One in two are planning a downshift of hours, but then 90% who are at home want to return.

And I think for me, the cards just...

When I looked at all the options, I had the ability to go part-time, which worked.

I had the ability to set up childcare for those two days that I really trusted.

Hmm

So would you talk a little bit about that? Like, how do you see a woman powerfully and intentionally setting herself up for a power pause so she doesn't lose touch with that professional identity that she's taken so long to grow?

Yeah.

So I want to touch on the first piece, which was the financial preparation, because whether or not this is a financial no-brainer for your family, right? So oftentimes what I'll hear women say is like, actually based on my income and the cost of childcare, it was like a net-net.

Even if it is that way, or you have the financial privilege for you didn't need a two-income household regardless, whatever that case may be, It is so important to plan together because the financial dignity that is achieved when you lay out all of your family finances, right? We have a ritual.

We do it at the beginning of the year.

We use essentially like a P&L from a company, but we apply it to our family, which I think is incredibly important that we treat our home as an organization.

And we are the two co-founders, right? And so as we were preparing, like I mentioned, I initially went part-time and then I eventually paused.

of career stuff, either while you were on that pause or kind of, you know, after you'd paused for a little while, how do you think that people could reenter with some confidence?

And in doing this work over the last few years, are there other pauses that you have heard about? I would imagine that people open up to you and share their stories about the different moments in life when they have taken a pause and how that also relates so much to the work that you're doing.

The research shows that one in three women feel forced to pause, which I think I wanna underscore only because this work still applies if it come, if it comes out of need or necessity.

It, it is about then taking back the narrative to be able to then walk through what's in front of you with a sense of possibility and a sense of confidence and a sense of empowerment.

So I recognize that women come to this choice, men and women, by the way, come to this choice to shift their time and energy away from paid work for a multitude of reasons.

Sometimes it's because of financial considerations.

As we know, especially in the United States, the, the cost of childcare and affordable childcare and quality childcare has made working out of the home a challenge for two-parent households, and so that's a reality.

I've seen women, uh, and men, by the way, talk about shifting their energy away from work because of mental health issues and f- and burnout and wanting to reset and reignite what comes next.

Yeah.

What was happening that made you say, "I gotta take a pause"?

Mm.

I'd spent pretty much my teens...

I moved, um, to the States when I was three years old, and I moved to an all white town outside of Boston.

And I'd spent pretty much from the age of six years old trying to fit.

And when I got to my 20s, I realized that work and the workforce could be my calling card.

That could be my entree into the spaces.

Mm.

Yeah

... and because of the cost of childcare.

When you realize that, it's not to say working out of the home is a luxury.

It's to say that the privilege is to get to choose, and the reason that that's important is because when we say one side, quote, unquote, "is a luxury," we deem it of less value, and we deem it of worthy of less support.

And I think stay-at-home mothers or women who step into a career break immediately step into this feeling of, "Well, it's a luxury that I get to do this," instead of what we offer, which is two parents together are making an informed decision.

And by the way, one in five stay-at-home parents right now are dads, so let, you know, gender aside.

Two parents hopefully doing money meetings every year.

When it's time to reenter the workforce if someone decides that's what they want to do, what are the biggest mistakes you're seeing women make, and how can they avoid them?