So for therapists who might not know your work and be aware of what you do, can you just give us a little bit of background of what that looks like?

Absolutely.

So first and foremost, I am a therapist, licensed marriage and family therapist in California, in Los Angeles specifically.

And I've always worked with women in their 20s to 40s.

Those high-functioning women, right? Over-functioning, high-functioning anxiety, people-pleasing perfectionism.

We know that presentation well.

I've more recently also begun working with mothers after I became a mom myself and saw how intense that transition can be, that identity shift.

Where I see some people get stuck is they're like, well, what should I be trying to aim for? What are people typing in to ChatGPT when they're looking for me? So what are your thoughts on that?

I mean, you told us already a little bit about that, but would you mind to expand on that as well, please?

Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

And there's probably a few different kind of spheres of influence in, in my kind of life that have impacted me in different ways when it comes to thinking about creativity.

And, and one of them is probably my, my journey as a professional, I suppose.

Yeah, you mentioned that, you know, I, I didn't go to university.

I started my first job at the, uh, London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic Ga-Games straight out of sixth form.

So, um, I would love for you to tell us more about Apps for Good.

Is that kind of how you looked at her, at the character? Is this really, this person, is this really good person wants to come out, but is so badly scarred from everything, all the shit that has been put on?

yeah i think that um the trauma that hannah went through with her mom is definitely a huge part of why she is the way she is like afraid to kind of speak up for herself and such and that's an interesting thing that you said about how hannah and samantha are both equally damaged because i think that's true they both went through different kinds of abuse but like they it evolved within them in very different ways obviously

you have trouble stabbing each other

or anything? That scene wasn't an easy scene because there's technicalities involved, obviously, with the stunts and stuff.

But I don't think that it was not easy because of us knowing each other.

The only thing that was a little difficult about that was...

Like not trying, making sure to not actually hit me as far as what Debra said.

Debra said

Mm-hmm

... that I help people resolve in my practice.

And as a result of those actions, your website ranks higher, but not just ranking higher for something random, ranking higher for the exact types of terms that your ideal clients are trying to, using to try to find you.

Okay So now that we've established what SEO is, what is AIO? So AIO stands for Artificial Intelligence Optimization.

So one of the things that, that I wanted to dispel fear around is I've been seeing a lot of posts on social media and articles saying things like, "SEO is dead.

AIO is the future." Now, what I don't like about these types of articles and clickbait is that for someone who is a therapist in private practice and is just trying to get their feet under them with marketing to begin with- Mm-hmm ...

they're just trying to learn what SEO is and implement it, right? They might even be investing in courses or SEO agencies to help them.

Mm-hmm

Yeah, for sure

... bear with me here.

Um, Black South Side neighborhoods in particular have been stripped away and also starved from investment.

So when things do come to a neighborhood, there are concerns about who is this for.

When I have heard organizers say, "This is a wholesale attempt by the Obamas to just push us out, they don't want us here," I, I don't agree with that sentiment.

I think that's going too f- too far.

My take has been, um, that there's a lot of overstating on all sides.

Mm-hmm.

... housing for Black folks.

Yeah.

One thing I'd love to mention about the geography of where the Obama Center sits is that it kind of straddles this extremely wealthy part of Hyde Park, and then you cross this park, and then you're at Hyde Park Academy, which like Natalie said, is actually in Woodlawn.

And so quickly you shift from like wealthy Hyde Park into a much lower income area.

There's affordable housing r- right around there that has been kind of under threat, and a lot of tenant unions have been organizing around it.

Um, the other thing I'd say, too, to these observations about how Jackson Park has been used and cherished over the years is I remember when the Obama Center was deciding on where they were going to build, and one of the advocates for building it in Jackson Park was the president's advisor, David Axelrod.

And I remember he famously said that nobody uses Jackson Park, um, and that this-

Yeah, for sure

Can you share how you created this mindset shift for women?

Yes.

Yeah.

One thing I hear, and I'll begin here, a lot of people do say to me, "Oh, I wish I could run." And then I ask them, "Do you like running?" "No, I don't even like running.

I don't want to run." So I'm like, "So don't force yourself to run," right? And so I just wanted to begin there because I think it's really important that we understand why we want to run.

And I know running is a simple thing.

We expect to put our runners on, run out the door, and go for a run.

love.If we've got a listener out there and she's listening to this at the moment and she's not sure where to start, but she knows she wants to start running and has a goal to try and, and achieve a run or five kilometers, 10 kilometers, or maybe she's run 20 kilometers and she wants to go in her first marathon, and there's some barriers that she might have in her mind, what would you say to her to try and encourage her to take another step?

Was it simply because we just had so many high rises, so much public housing stock, or was there a different part to that as well?

I would say it was mostly that.

Atlanta started experimenting with mixed income, but just the scale wasn't the same.

And Chicago was looked at from other cities.

So you had other municipalities or agencies saying, let's look at mixed income.

So mixed income isn't inherently bad, of course, but some of the problems were...

OK, well, this homeowner is going to help its public housing neighbor get a job.

And it hasn't been easy.