Murray Bowen
American psychiatrist and professorWikipedia
54
MENTIONS
26
EPISODES
23
PODCASTS
Search complete. 54 mentions across 26 episodes found for "Murray Bowen".
Sep 15, 2026
Raffaela MarieHOST
But...
Raffaela MarieHOST
If we look through the lens of Dr. Murray Bowen's family systems, we can begin to truly understand what is going on, not only in the individual, but inside the family.
Raffaela MarieHOST
What is going on underneath the surface to create this level of dysfunction in a human being? What Dr.
Raffaela MarieHOST
Bowen found is that the family is not just individual people living together, it is an emotional unit.
Dustin SnyderGUEST
triangulation?Yeah.
Dustin SnyderGUEST
So this, the triangulation comes from the clinical psychology side, and, uh, Murray Bowen pioneered the field of, uh, family systems theory, where, you know, human systems is kind of a, a similar moniker there.
Dustin SnyderGUEST
From family systems, we know from the research that there's something within groups of people.
Dustin SnyderGUEST
And so Bowen also wrote about, like, you know, he was working in large healthcare organizations while he was doing this research, and seeing the parallels, he's like, "Oh, my coworkers are doing the same things that I'm documenting in these family groups." And so what you have in a group of people is what's called a differentiation and an ego mass.
Steve CussGUEST
didn't know at that point that my overconfidence was a massive protective mechanism against lots of worry and fear.
Steve CussGUEST
But the head chaplain was trained by the founder of systems theory by Murray Bowen.
Steve CussGUEST
He would come every Wednesday morning and train us in systems theory.
Steve CussGUEST
And the simple idea being that everybody carries anxiety.
Steve CussGUEST
And then the longer your relationship, the harder it is to stop catching and spreading.
Steve CussGUEST
One of the things we say kind of tongue in cheek is when umbilical cords are involved, it's 10 times harder if you have children or if you get back to your family of origin and you quickly revert back.
Steve CussGUEST
Murray Bowen, the founder, he said, how many minutes can you be around your parents before you become an eight year old? So you see it in that way.
Steve CussGUEST
But then if you take a typical staff, a team that works together, you can just walk into that team and watch the reactivity.
Dan PurcellGUEST
But part of the task of an adult is We can feel emotions, but it doesn't mean we have to act according to those emotions all the time.
Dan PurcellGUEST
And the better we get at being more principled, this is a principle developed by Dr. Murray Bowen in the 1950s and 60s.
Dan PurcellGUEST
And he has a fancy word for it called differentiation.
Dan PurcellGUEST
But it's this concept of, can I learn how to not be so reactive to my emotions, live more principled? And remain in relationship with other people,
Dan PurcellGUEST
So they're kind of all on this yo-yo, this seesaw.
Dan PurcellGUEST
And it's not a difficult...
Dan PurcellGUEST
The psychological term for this also coined by Dr. Murray Bowen is called enmeshment or emotionally enmeshed.
Dan PurcellGUEST
It kind of feels like a chess where you're in stalemate.
CarrieHOST
Right, let me give you the psychology because it's probably the sharpest thing I've brought you in this series and I'd like you to have it properly.
CarrieHOST
There was an American psychiatrist called Murray Bowen who worked from the 1950s onward and rather than treating people one at a time, he looked at whole families as a system.
CarrieHOST
And one of the patterns he described is called over-functioning and under-functioning reciprocity.
CarrieHOST
Here's what it says.
Laura Lewis-BarrHOST
It really is essential.
Laura Lewis-BarrHOST
I think part of the research I did, the guy who came up with family systems theory, his name is Murray Bowen, and he looks at this idea of denying my differences as being really unhealthy, that I can't show up with my gifts if I've obliterated myself.
Laura Lewis-BarrHOST
It's harder, though, because then conflict can come, but that's okay.
Marci MadaryHOST
Then we all sit in a room and are very quiet.
Hugh BallouHOST
We got three, let's stay with three.
Hugh BallouHOST
You know, how much can we handle? And then we add one more thing, does it topple this, this whole, this whole house? So let's talk about, um, psychologist, psychiatrist, excuse me, Murray Bowen, uh, k- had the concept in Bow- Bowen family systems.
Hugh BallouHOST
It's the antithesis of Freud and Jung, but it's, it's, uh, it's about leadership really, and he has his eight concepts.
Hugh BallouHOST
And he talks in there about differentiation of self and remaining calm.
Hugh BallouHOST
So the leader in your system is the anchor in a, in a period of turbulence.
Hugh BallouHOST
And, and Bowen says our anxiety is transmitted through the whole culture, and it comes back to us.
Hugh BallouHOST
And then we have triangles and relationships, and the anxiety goes around the triangle.
Hugh BallouHOST
So talk about the leader being the an- anchor in time of turbulence.
Bron WatsonHOST
That sentence does the boundary setting work that a hundred reassurances can't.
Bron WatsonHOST
So how do you actually do that? How do you stay true to your own feelings without your kids absorbing them as if they were their own? There's a psychiatrist named Murray Bowen who has a concept called differentiation of self.
Bron WatsonHOST
And it is the clearest language I've found for the balance I was reaching for without knowing that it had a name.
Bron WatsonHOST
Differentiation of self is the ability to stay closely connected to the people you love while still holding a clear, separate sense of your own feelings.
Philip WeissHOST
And that's the whole episode really today.
Philip WeissHOST
Welcome back to Noble Metal, where we explore leadership at work and in life through the lens of Bowen Family Systems Theory.
Philip WeissHOST
So nothing in your inbox this week is most likely a live nuclear torpedo, but the mechanism underneath that story is identical, just smaller and really slower.
Philip WeissHOST
And it shows up maybe in your Tuesday morning staff meetings as reliably as it showed up on that submarine.
Philip WeissHOST
I'm asking you to think about anyway for the rest of this episode.
Philip WeissHOST
When the room gets anxious, are you the thermostat or are you the thermometer? I'll get back to that in a second.
Philip WeissHOST
Quick refresher, though, on the lineage regarding Bowen family systems theory here for anybody joining us sort of mid-series or who needs a reminder.
Philip WeissHOST
This show leans heavily into Bowen family systems theory.
Vanessa BennettHOST
They learn to scan, anticipate rupture, stabilize their caregivers, and absorb blame as a way of staying connected and feeling or staying safe.
Vanessa BennettHOST
Murray Bowen described this in terms of low differentiation.
Vanessa BennettHOST
It's the difficulty separating what is mine from what belongs to someone else.
Vanessa BennettHOST
In an undifferentiated system, the emotional field of the family becomes the child's emotional field.
8 MINS LATER
Vanessa BennettHOST
And it can be really hard to see from the inside.
Vanessa BennettHOST
I also want to say something about what it actually feels like when the control does begin to release because I think people expect relief and are surprised by what they find instead.
Vanessa BennettHOST
So going back to Bowen again.
Vanessa BennettHOST
So Bowen's concept of differentiation, right? The capacity to remain in emotional contact with others without losing a distinct sense of self is often described in clinical language that makes it sound very calm and clean.
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