That's an oversimplification.

I met Steve Bannon over coffee at a hotel in Mayfair, London.

My impression of him at that time was that he was clearly feeling that world events were moving in his direction, was clearly feeling that Europe was about to follow America, and was very busy networking and making relationships and forging links with people on this side of the Atlantic.

And so when I met him at that particular time, remember, this is before we enter the second part of Trump's presidency, I think he felt that the world was his oyster, and he was very aware of his influence.

I remember sitting across the table from Steve Bannon and looking at a copy of my book that he'd read, and the notes were endless.

I mean, he seemed to give the impression that he consumes and digests research incredibly quickly and moves on to the next thing.

You can not just have tremendous electoral results in the spring of 19, but send a message to Brussels.

One of the tensions was that many populist movements have been on the go in Europe for 30 years, 40 years.

Hey, gents, how we doing? Merry Christmas.

but also because of his very visible interest in intellectual currents that are sweeping through Western politics.

And that basically led to us having a coffee and a conversation in London, I think in late 2018, early 2019. impression of Steve Bannon, I think firstly was that he has a pretty solid grasp of what's going on in Western democracies.

Secondly, however, he has a world view of what's happening in the West.

which doesn't always transplant from America to Europe as well as he may think.

So if you go back to the Trump presidency, there was a view at the time that what Donald Trump had started was going to spread across much of Europe.

In reality, the opposite was true.

Key players perceived it to be the case that Bannon had won it.

Or w- was it the fact that, like Keir Starmer, they were completely enamored of the Davos WF crowd, which they regarded as, like, somehow more stylish than, you know, the mere plodding pedestrians in the parliament?

Well, you're answering your own questions in a way, Jordan, because the answer is they're not conservatives.

What has happened to the Conservative Party, one of the oldest, most successful parties in the history of democracy, is that it has completely abandoned its ideological roots.

It's become a liberal party.

The vast majority of MPs in Parliament, uh, conservative MPs, are essentially liberal MPs.

They are the ones that put mass immigration on steroids.

They are the ones that put net zero on steroids.

Define them, and then tell us what the case is.