If you're creating kind of this new story, how do you preserve that original emotional connection that so many people have without simply just trying to copy and paste what was there in the late 90s, early 2000s, and before, and kind of just modernizing it? How do you kind of bridge that gap?

Well, yeah, you have to balance that because there are still like Facebook groups out there of people who are huge enthusiasts for Ghost Town.

So our plan has us preserving the core Ghost Town just as people remember it, you know, hopefully better with saloon shows and cowboy stunt shows.

Think Ghost Town Alive at Knott's Berry Farm, if you've ever been there.

right yeah um but we're broadening the story you know it's called ghost town in the sky we're we're kind of elevating toward the in in the sky part that's more about the inspiration that you experience when you're uh elevated to a higher place you're having this mountaintop experience so not only would we have the core kind of old west uh town that people remember but We would have a lot more outdoor recreation amenities like zip lines and canopy tours and alpine coasters that celebrate the mountains.

And then making a connection actually with the history of North Carolina from being the site of America's first gold rush to the North Carolina mountains kind of being that first frontier where you had pioneers like Daniel Boone.

and Davey Crockett.

Depending on how you Google, and I know there are ongoing conversations, is the answer there are still ongoing conversations about the future of Ghost Town in the Sky?

He's like,

you're too subjective and you're emotional.

And I'm like, I'm not even sure at the time I knew what subjective was, but I knew what emotional meant and I knew I was emotional.

So one of the things I did to fix the emotion part is anytime something happens to me, although with my kids and my wife, I'm not as good.

But anytime something happens to me, I try and wait 15 to 20 minutes before I react just so I can not not react poorly.

But to go to the subjective part, which all it is, is it's an opinion.

My opinions were wrong because my opinions were always wrong.

What's the strategy I should be using in that role?

So then you moved into art, right? Versus video games that didn't work out for you.

Yeah.

So I just started doing so.

Yeah, I started just thinking about doing this sort of stuff because I just have like a sort of desire to do it.

And I've always loved films.

And that's like my number one passion in life.

It's like film.

i don't know how accurate that is you might explain to me oh no it's oh that is correct yeah

Throughout your years with Disney, what did you learn about those universal elements that connect audiences, regardless of age, culture, background?

You know, if you've been to Walt Disney World, and it sounds like you have, just look around.

You can see it's a melting pot, you know? That's because good storytelling is universal.

It's human.

And, you know, I learned that good story has some key elements.

Just think about, remember back to English class, you know, about what makes a good story.

It's a place.

That's the essence of it.

yeah the most interaction with the crew you have is in the yard in the morning

exactly yeah i remember like one of our yards it was all gravel all the trucks would come in and like Alltech was a fairly big company, right? They were probably pushing like maybe like seven, eight crews at the time out of that yard.

And all the linemen and apprentices would come in.

They'd throw everything off the side of the truck.

Yeah.

And there's just nuts and bolts everywhere.

And there's like six of us TTs running around like chickens with their head cut off, trying to pick these bolts and nuts up and throw them in the bins and everything.

like, no, I haven't actually.

Uh, Drew Ellis brought him up a couple times when he was on a couple years back.

Matter of fact, I think he was doing something like this, right? A-and, and somebody asked him a question like th-this was basically the question, right? "Hey, I was in this position, I was buddies with everybody on the team, and now I'm, [chuckles] now I'm leading.

How do you suggest that I do that?" And I'll never forget his answer, which was, "You're leading the team, which means you have a different respo-- a different set of responsibilities than you used to have, and you need to make that clear to the people that are on your team." And I like how you put in the RPA meeting in there to, you know, [chuckles] show how to do this because it, it is not easy, but you used a word that I love, which is what are the facts? And I think the other thing that I would add here, and I'm gonna throw myself under the bus here because when I was first promoted years ago, I did this completely wrong, which I think a lot of people do because they don't get any training when they get put into the role, is I just went in and was like, "Okay, I'm the top performer.

I know what everybody's weaknesses are.

I'm just gonna teach everybody to do it how I am, and I'll fix everything." And that was about the last thing that happened.

[chuckles] So I think facts and, you know, what you're holding them accountable to is, is a big thing here.

Yeah, that's great.

I had a client last year that was in long sales cycle in medical, okay? And when I say long, this was anywhere from a year to two for a deal, which is a, a long time.