And so the activity was more important than the, the device.

The debate around, like, screen time and children and creativity is a very hot topic.

I think, to me, this whole emergence of AI in children's lives, so much of it feels like one big experiment that we're living in real time and trying to work out what this is doing to our brains, and I think a lot of that we're still trying to get a, a, an understanding of.

But I would say that a lot of, this is just my opinion, of what the issues around screen time and AI i- and children's learning, it is highlighting a lot of issues or amplifying a lot of issues that have actually been in place for a really long time in education, but it's shining a new light on them.

And you know that I think ultimately it's demonstrating that this approach to learning that is just focused on drill and repeat, of just transferring information from an adult to a child is outdated.

And is doing that so much better than a human at this point, that it's almost like we need to teach children to think for themselves, to be good listeners, to learn through their full sensory systems, to be empathetic.

And all of these things like making and creating with materials, like making, creating through artworks is a brilliant way to do that.

Tell me a little bit about what kind of activities you have there that relate to soundscapes.

Yeah, that's true.

I mean, I am really interested in the work that has come out with PISA around their new model for evaluating and assessing creative learning through the five dimensional model of creativity.

Well, yeah, so I think Guy Claxton worked quite heavily on that.

But it's really thinking about like different kind of dispositions and kind of like habits of mind that are cultivated, you know, through different sorts of learning experiences.

So it's like skilled and conceptual development play a part in in that assessment model alongside other things such as looking for evidence of collaboration, of use of imagination, of persistence alongside the development of specific skill sets.

And so that to me is a much more holistic way of thinking about how a young child thinks and learns and develops.

Um, and yeah, like coming back to like the art plays study, we're working with, uh, a handful of like amazing, uh, BPS, uh, three and four year old classrooms as part of that.

So what do teachers have to say about implementing this framework themselves?