Are we, are we gonna get there with AI in 10 years? Are we gonna say this is an ill, and we need to do something about this?

Yes.

I, I think that's exactly, that's spot on.

I, I mean, I'm a conditional optimist, so I'm a great believer in the power of AI and its uses, and I use, uh, AI every day of the week, uh, for my own, um, uh, political and professional use.

So I'm ...

I, I embrace it totally.

But I'm a conditional optimist in terms of, um, saying that what we have to do if we're going to, uh, make the best use of it and we're not gonna have a kind of, uh, new Luddism as a backlash.

[laughs] So don't worry.

Mm

...

in, in many ways, not only how we create that public trust because, you know, if you're a brand, uh, uh, you know, you are going to have to convince the consumer that, um, if you're, uh, using it, supplying it, employing, uh, uh, using, uh, AI instead of employing people, um, uh, you know, you, you've got to persuade them that you are trustworthy, uh, in, in all of that.

Um, and I do think that's a fundamental, um, point.

But also, you know, the impact on creativity.

Uh, we've had the Alan Milburn report about NEET people, not in, young people not in employment training, et cetera, education.

Um, uh, what's the impact of AI going to be on them? At the moment, the jury's a little bit out.

Yeah.

To make sound decisions, you need a clear ethical framework to guide you.

Well, I think they can start by understanding what they mean by an ethical framework for a start.

We mean actually the principles that were set out by the OECD as far back as 2019.

You know, we're talking about transparency.

We're talking about freedom from discrimination.

We're talking about benefit as opposed to detriment.

We're talking about a number of different aspects, which, you know, you can call them ethics, you can call them rights, but they are principles that if you introduce a new technology, it would be extremely sensible for the corporate reputation of a business to adopt.

As with any change, one of the biggest challenges is managing how teams or boards respond.

He says, how insulated is the UK if the global AI economic bubble bursts?

We're pretty vulnerable, actually, especially our UK government, because, you know, and Chris mentioned the AWS outage recently.

We had a Microsoft outage as well.

This is, you know, vulnerability on a big scale.

If the whole of your government depends on three or four US suppliers.

I mean, if Palantir went down for any particular reason, our government in defense and across our health service, you know, could well be in trouble because Palantir helps to organize all the data within those two services.

So we haven't mentioned them, but they are a significant player internationally in those two sectors and in the UK as well.

She says, what prevents innovators from being reduced to data tenants only in the big tech's empire?

I think something's wrong with the machine.

Absolutely agree with David.

It starts really further down the pipeline at school in terms of the kinds of critical thinking skills that we need.

The trouble is we're starting from here and therefore corporates, you know, they need to assess the risk of, if you like, over-dependence.

on these tools where there is no proper human in the loop where there probably should be.

There is an over dependence on the tools and there is no real human intervention which actually could get the same kind of result.

So the skills of individuals using these tools are going to be absolutely critical.

When the U.S., he says, removes AI guardrails, is the U.S. population or the world really ready? Tim, I think this one's tailor-made for you.

So Lord Tim Clement-Jones, Lord Tim, Let's talk about three specific steps that we should be talking about now to prepare for evolving AI regulation, especially in the UK and EU, because it's going to look different regionally.

Yeah, I think what you have to do, Ray, is start with the corporate values.

This is a business decision.

This isn't something kind of new and strange that's arriving.

We're used to dealing with regulation in business, in data protection, in environmental safety, and all that kind of thing.

So what you have to do, first of all, is start out saying, well, what are my business objectives? What are the values that I'm trying to build into the business by using new technology like artificial intelligence and then the second thing you have to do is work out what standards you need to conform to the kinds of regulation that are coming down the track and you know the trouble is that if you're an international business if you're a global business you've got many jurisdictions that you're trying to work in And that's one of the difficulties for executives.

And what you've got to try and do is triangulate between the different kinds of regulation and look at what are the international standards.

advice to the private sector, how they can best approach, you know, public leaders such as yourself to really have healthy collaboration and consensus building.

He says, how will regulation help de-risk AI-led decision-making for customers? He's saying customers, but I think that's really for all of us in general.

Chris and I are both fans of putting forward private members bills and Chris has had a terrific private members bill on AI regulation in general.

I've taken a narrower approach which is about taking decisions by automated algorithm in the public sector and that is also a very big issue in the private sector now.

The increasing use of AI models in the private sector to take automated decisions is going to be a bigger and bigger issue as time goes on.

And we have to have a risk assessment, an impact assessment to start with.

We have to have transparency about the use of these models.

We have to have the ability of the citizen or the consumer to be able to make a complaint, to understand what the decision has been made about them, then make a complaint and get redress.

Who wants to grab that one?