Law and Gospel

And I think what might be interesting here is, is that the presence of Jesus Christ Certainly gets talked about by Lutherans in regards to the Lord's Supper and having a real presence or the true presence of the body and blood of Jesus Christ in the supper for us for the forgiveness of sins.

But I will say that it appears to me that on this topic of presence, and then related the Lord's Supper, the distinction between law and gospel is like almost completely ignored from those conversations.

It's like, we have a law and gospel conversation.

That's great.

We have those categories.

class at Bible study between the Calvinists and the Reformed.

And then usually, again, we're stuck to the realm of metaphysics or maybe some recalling of Luther doing the is-means-is thing when it comes to presence.

But rarely will you hear that this is a matter of the distinction between law and gospel.

Help us to see how to think about that.

I mean, that gets into, I think, law and gospel conversations there as well.

But walk us into this Mosaic Covenant and how that law covenant really is something that in the New Testament, Paul, he's referring, you mentioned earlier, that we're no longer under law, specifically the law covenant, the covenant with Moses, covenant with Israel.

Uh, we're under grace, covenant that is now made in Christ.

It's a whole covenant package that has to be kept in mind, and then seeing how that then works itself out in redemptive history and fulfillment in Christ.

So Steve, I wanna go back for just something that you said.

You talk about we, I think, thinking about those who would hold to progressive covenantalism, have been charged of not making that distinction between law and gospel.

At least that's one of the things that has been put out there.

So, so important to, to highlight that.

And, and I know we're, we're past time right now, but I just, I just want to say in sort of wrapping up, I, you know, I have taught on the sort of distinction between law and gospel all around the country, many, many times.

And a lot of the time people are really like for a lot of people, they're brand new to this.

Like they, they've never heard it before.

However, in this program, we're going to ever so slightly shift.

One of the things that we picked up on when we were reading the book undercover was how frequently John Bevere undermined the gospel itself and frankly confuses what is called law and gospel.

It's going to be an interesting program.

I'm going to toss it over to Miller.

We'll go through the quotes and we'll tell you what we think are the concerns and show up in the comment section.

Let us know if you agree, disagree, and we'll begin some dialogue.

Yeah, it's important probably for the viewer to understand before we start watching any of the clips, what law and gospel is.

So this is a reformed theological framework that makes sense of the commands of scripture.

And that is that I see a total of seven covenants between the two testaments, six in the Old Testament, one in the New Testament.

And we will talk about that when we kind of get to those covenants in history in the Old Testament, as well as a little bit of the application in terms of baptism and law gospel issues and things like that.

Let me ask a question as I don't know how much you individually have thought about this topic.

Maybe a lot, maybe not a lot.

And everybody who comes into Jesus Christ becomes part of that spiritual Israel.

There's other things that are very helpful to think about here.

My friend, John Moffitt, that we've done many shows together, just came out recently with the Law Gospel episode for his Theocast.

Law Gospel is a distinction that I've learned since a white horse inn way back in the mid-90s.

And he finally got so frustrated, he said, Rod, that's what it says right here.

And then I knew he didn't read law and gospel the same way we do, though he thinks he does.

There will be places in here where we're going to do it by law and gospel.

This is not going to be done the same way your local Baptist does it.

If you're a Baptist, you'll probably notice a difference here as to how we do the text together.

All right.

All right.

So I think this brings us to what we could call the topic of the episode, which is basically how Lutherans... read the text or the distinction between law and gospel and just how different it is than other traditions that at least use or recognize or have categories of those same two words, law and gospel.