So what advice would you give marketers, actually at any stage, to be honest, who dream of launching their own product one day?

day?I mean, don't start...

Sorry, start before you've got the product.

So like if you're dreaming about it, if you think, "Oh my God, one day," use your personal brand and start documenting that.

Realize that the day is now.

You do not have to have the business idea sorted.

You don't even have to have it anywhere near even conceptualized, because if you start your personal brand and talking about what you would like to do and how you're gonna do it, and rooms that you're sitting in, you know, you can come to the Marketers Day, for example, and learn so much and then talk about your learnings.

But what is, what is next for you? What's exciting you right now? Like whether it's in the marketing industry or just you personally, like what, what's coming up?

Same boat.

I've had a personal brand longer than my brand.

Well, I think it's probably my first brand was that.

Kennedy and Zed specifically, like the Instagram account.

I, yep, sold myself a lot.

Like the products, the trialing and testing, just figuring stuff out, pushing other people's brands, all of that.

It's been a journey and I'm really grateful for the opportunity to learn like that.

I saw that post.

you've done this probably a particularly tough time in both the domestic and international economy what's the sort of challenge has been in starting a business and being young and starting a business

I'd say, to be fair, number one, I reckon young is probably more of a pro than a con right now.

We're quite resilient in trying basically anything to see what can stick.

I would say one of the harder parts is almost the attitude.

Everyone kind of just, maybe it is the market, yes, but I feel like the attitude towards the market is probably the hardest bit.

Everyone expects you to have hardships in business, and of course there is.

actually just easy day all the time.

And you've kind of built this for yourself, right?