And being a Marine and also growing up in the time that you grew up in, I'm pretty sure it was really difficult to be able to identify those emotions.

The, uh, whi- while in Vietnam and made two beach landings, uh, from the ships, and we landed by, by heli.

So as a, as a machine gunner, I, I carried the, uh, M60 machine gun plus, uh, had 100 rounds on the, on the gun itself, plus, uh, three strap, three of them strapped around me, uh, helmet, flak jacket, backpack, three canteens of water, K-bar, .45 pistol, E-tool.

Tremendous amount of weight.

I was a, a skinny little kid to start with.

[laughs] And, and so that was, it was really getting up there as far as weight.

And we'd come in on a helicopter and, and the helicopter, of course, didn't wanna land.

What was the catalyst that brought you back to God?

So I can only imagine the things you've seen over there.

Well, the thing was, I mean...

When I went in and when I went to Vietnam, I was still angry.

I was still sad over my dad's death.

And so I welcomed the fact that I was going into combat at the outset, you know, before anybody shot at me.

But a lot of things were pretty gruesome.

But also, at that particular time, the Vietnam War was on television.

my memories, the emotions, um, you know, my, my feelings and, and, uh, my

preacher,

and I'd preach to my imaginary congregation, you know, that sat on the stairway.

And every once in a while, And being a regular churchgoer and everything, I knew how people acted in church sometimes.

And I would have to call out a couple of those people in my congregation to settle down and listen while I preach.

But I really enjoyed that.

And I knew that as soon as I graduated from high school, I'd be going to college and then to seminary.

But then as a senior in high school, my dad died.

But it's up to him, and he's empowering us, and there are some things we think we need to do that God says, no, that doesn't need to be done today, right? Is that kind of the mentality that we're taking into it?