So when you went from there, How did you then start to scale the business? Like, was it scalable when it was just you and one-on-one? So what did you do with the business? No, it was

not.

Right.

My son turned five in the summer of, well, he was going to turn five in the summer, just after the summer of 2015.

Yeah.

And he was about to start school.

Yeah.

Yeah, it was just like six

as you embark or continue to build or as whoever's listening to this our audience today as they embark or continue to build their personal brand how can they actually get out of their

own way The first thing is to decide on one platform because I think that there's so much overwhelm that comes with visibility.

A lot of people are teaching visibility masters personal branding.

You've got to first understand what your positioning is, like who is it that you want to be visible for? And who do you need to get in front of? So that's your audience.

Is it in a physical room? Is it online? And so there you have to decide on what is your strategy.

So is it speaking on stages right now? Is it press and PR? Is it becoming a published author? Is it, you know, brand partnerships? You need to decide on your why first and foremost.

And it will evolve and change over the years.

So talk to me a bit about any personal brand faux pas or grave errors.

So the authority live and the authority table, they then followed on from the second chapter or are they an offshoot from that or are they standalone?

No, they're part of the second chapter.

And so the authority table are quarterly... events lunches dinners where we bring women into the room for conversation about life business the challenges the highs the lows it's about proximity and access to women where you can share your peers you can network you can build relationships i say your next client may be in the room you may be somebody else's client your next collaboration or partner you know it could be the door to a next opportunity being in that room and so we need to have safe spaces as women and women in business and you know we we face unique challenges as well and i like to bring the diversity you know in terms of the mix because again some of these can be silos and become silos and i think there's a place for those silos but at the same time For us to learn and to grow, we need to kind of all come together at some point.

And so that's what the authority table is.

It's all about building brand authority.

That's the underlying theme.

Each table has a different short kind of theme to it.

What I love, though, is that you've graduated from the HarperCollins Academy and you're finally publishing a book.

So what happens in Second Chapter Studios?

So second chapter studios is all about helping women to uncover for some of them, their true identity of who they are, because often than not, they've gone through life performing everybody else, whether it be parents and the career paths that they chose, their children, their partners, their employer, but actually what do you want to do with the rest of your life? As you know, I always say your life is your legacy.

So what does yours look like? So if we're not actively building our legacy while we're alive, how do we control that narrative once we're gone? And what impact would we like to make? Second chapter gives you that opportunity to do that.

And so a lot of the time, some of my clients are women who have done the corporate career climbing and thought, is this it? Actually, I have enough skills and expertise to build a business that and create a lifestyle by design according to my terms and conditions, with my skills, That fulfills so I can fulfill the true potential that I believe I'm called to be.

And we are the agency that allows them to do that.

So whether it's support right at the very beginning of your mindset, your identity, who you are, what your values, how are you going to show, why are you building this brand? Straight through to all the aspects of brand authority in personal branding.

And so there's this thing around visibility now, it's like a buzzword.

and