I wonder if you could say a bit more about that and a bit of the reframing of what does it mean to think about it moving from an impact case to really a business case?

Absolutely.

And I think a lot of this builds on what Manuel just said.

So the big reframe or the big shift is that a lot of how we talked about and thought about circularity was around the R levers, right? So seven, nine, how many? Reduce, refuse, reuse, recycle.

They're extremely important, but oftentimes far from the business reality of the executives that you talk to, meaning that they can totally see why this is better for the environment, but it still is a disconnect to what is my...

Concern Monday morning.

And basically what we differentiate is license to operate versus license to innovate, which is pretty much what you outlined before.

So I don't know, I wanted to finish by asking maybe you in the first case, Julia, like really what can executives and organizations do differently even tomorrow to start on that journey?