And, and just to get a little bit deeper, like when does it make sense for a founder to, you know, go and buy a giant billboard that you see when you're driving from SFO into the city? When does it make sense for you to kind of do a more targeted sales activity or motion elsewhere?

Yeah.

And I think the way that we tried to make this make sense, of course, we did very consulting style with a two-by-two matrix.

I did never work at a consulting firm, but I'll do my best.

And so we really were thinking about, okay, what are the axes that we should be kind of mapping opportunities against? And so we decided upon the Y-axis is really what we called the buyer's exposure.

And it's intentionally called exposure because there's the exposure of making a mistake with the solution that you buy.

There's also the exposure of the solution inside of your company.

[laughs]

[laughs]

And then, and then, uh, and then, like, another couple seconds go by, and he goes, "Dan Fox, what's your vertical leap?" And Dan goes like, "39." Like, Dan was a freak.

I don't remember how, he had, like, some huge vertical leap.

And he goes, "Joe, what's your vertical leap?" And I go, "27." He goes, "24." [laughs] And so he's on me, like, just, like, talking about how I'm not quick or fast, and this goes on he-- and, like, to spare everyone, this goes on for, like, two minutes of him telling me all the different ways that I'm, like, unathletic or not good enough to play.

And, and everyone's looking at me like, "Please, Joe, say something so that we can get out of this very uncomfortable period where coach is just ragging on you." And finally it hits me, and I just blurt out at him as he's, like, ranting to the room about how terrible I am.

I go, "I have to be perfect." And he turns to me, and he goes, "You have to be perfect." And he, and, and he turns to the rest of the room, and he says, "Who in here doesn't believe that we can win with Joe playing bench A calls?" And bench A calls was basically, like, our, our home base.

It was a four down front with, uh, it was, like, a 4-3.

Uh, and uh, and then what? Like h- talk to me about the transition out of venture and into, into operating.