Jeremy Scahill

And it's extraordinary that this sort of basic equality of rights under which if Israel has a right to defend itself, then Palestine has a right to defend itself, is just so far from being conceivable to the American.

Even Ro Khanna, who went to the West Bank, very sympathetic guy, you know, when Jeremy Scahill pressed him on this, you know, he could not bring himself to say that Palestinians had a right of armed self-defense, even though it's very easy for anyone to say that Israel has a right of armed self-defense.

And you recently had an exchange with...

the rather odious Matt Iglesias about this same thing, this way in which these people just can't conceive of the idea that Palestinians actually have a right to armed self-defense in the same way that Israel does.

He's giant.

And then Scahill booed.

Yeah.

Jackson Dart.

Jackson Dart, Scahill booed.

It was a good game.

And, uh, yeah, it was ve- and that was a great way to, uh, to end the Sunday.

Milo Yiannopoulos was getting booked on Realtime, especially around the promotion of his book, Dangerous.

Jeremy Scahill actually dropped out

of one of those episodes in protest.

Yeah, you got to realize, like, what Milo was doing was, again, aside from the very self-evident whitewashing of white nationalism, like, Breitbart's blogs were a deluge of anti-Muslim dreck, anti-feminist dreck, and really, honestly, anti-LGBTQ dreck as well.

It's not confirmed, but there was talk that perhaps AI was used for selecting targets in Iran, including the, the target that ended up being bombed by the United States on the first day that killed 170 schoolgirls.

And as a c- matter of fact, I remember, uh, the first story that I ever did at "The Intercept" when we launched "The Intercept" in 2014, we were in the middle of the Snowden reporting, was Jeremy Scahill had come to my house in, in Rio, and he had a source inside the US, uh, government that had given him a bunch of documents about how bombing targets and drone targets were selected.

And we combined the archives that we had, and we did a story on how the drone, the people we were selecting for killing by drones weren't being selected by human intelligence, but rather by algorithmic analysis.

You know, like if you meet with some guy who's designated a terrorist, you get 100 points.

They don't really know how to deal with that.

And I want to ask you about this because I talked recently, like last week, about that interview that Jeremy Scahill did with Ro Khanna.

Where Ro Khanna, despite trying to, you know, kind of find this lane that's more critical, that's more critical of Israel.

It's a new lane for him.

It shouldn't even be called aid.

I think it's Jeremy Scahill who points out that it's not even aid.

It's like life-saving necessities.

Yeah, which was not delivered at anywhere near the minimal level, which is why so many people have suffered and died and succumbed to injuries that could have been treated had Israel not been blocking medical supplies and let people leave to get treatment elsewhere, including in Egypt and Jordan.

Because I really try and see what we're doing.

There is actually a long lineage of independent journalism that goes back to whether it's black newspapers, indigenous newspapers, people like John Pilger, then the whole generation that came up during the war on terror, people like yourself, Jeremy Scahill, all these people who were doing it.

And I sort of see what me and osman are trying to do in in that lineage that has like a pretty rich history and there are sort of standards and things and the kind of study of it or the way it's talked about as this new kind of algorithmically driven outrage machine or something is just not i think what what it is

And people have often internet brain, right, where everything only started two years ago, or I'm going to talk about Palestine a bit later, but not everything started after October 7.

This is not going to be the tit for tat thing that we did during the 12-day war." They even wrote a letter to, like, the UN where they, [laughs] where they laid all this stuff out.

They told, they told it to us, to Jeremy Scahill in interviews.

They said it publicly.

Like, it was not a surprise to anybody who was listening.

But Drop Site is doing something different.

Right.

Yeah, to, the, the immediate answer to that just, um, Jeremy, Jeremy Scahill's reporting on the, the Gaza genocide then had produced enough sources, uh, so that, so that when they, they expanded the war over to Iran, you know, he was w- he was better positioned than pretty much any Western reporter, uh, to be able, um, to report accurately on what, on, on what their thinking was and how they were planning to respond to these, these attacks.

But to your, to your broader point, yes.

So clearly, I mean, I respect Ro Khanna for coming on the Vanguard.

I respect Ro Khanna for taking the tough questions from Jeremy Scahill on dropside.

That means a lot to me.

But clearly, that hasn't helped his name recognition.