With those big, broad categories, how do we begin to like map out how they would fit on like this i guess spectrum of risk factor like how like what's the that next layer of analysis

so i i think the way that we tried to take it is you know it's a category of fame seeking but to say they're doing it for attention that's a very surface level explanation we know behaviors don't operate like that right we know there's it's a bunch of stuff that's all working together um that's that's almost kind of conspiring to lead you down a a certain path so what we were looking to do is identify how might these variables interplay with one another you know um how does how what what is happening with fame seeking and like victimization for example well i mean you know they're they're both basically can function as establishing operations right they're they're motivating variables if if if fame and infamy are really um valuable to you you know then you're going to engage in behaviors that produce those doesn't mean you're immediately going to go shoot up some people there's lots of ways of gaining fame, but most of the ways of gaining fame are pretty hard.

If none of the listeners here have ever fired a gun, you could figure it out real fast.

It's not hard at all.

There's very minimal response effort.

And then the victimization, how does that factor in from sort of a behavior analytic perspective, that's another motivating variable, right? If you're victimized, then where you're victimized and your victimizer, like all of those become really aversive variables.

Well, what do you do when aversive variables are around? I mean, you avoid them or you terminate them, right? Like you engage in escape or avoidance.

yeah i think that's incredibly interesting and i really enjoyed the the part of the paper where you talked about that emergent behavior trap um and sort of how that how those variables we were just talking about sort of feed into that and can create that can you can you speak a little bit more about this idea of the trap for folks that might not be as familiar with behavior traps