So what you're saying is in order to become endorsed, you need to apply, you need to prove that you have insurance.

Yes, you do.

And particularly around indemnity insurance.

Now, just about all master plumber practitioners have to have a minimum insurance level for our membership.

The one that has always been a bit grey is indemnity insurance.

And indemnity insurance is when you're designing.

Now, the reality is when we're getting residential builds, we don't always get a plumbing design as part of that.

We want to make sure that we don't see that.

You need to prove that you have insurance.

Yes, you do.

And particularly around indemnity insurance.

Now, just about all Master Plumber practitioners have to have a minimum insurance level for our membership.

The one that has always been a bit grey is indemnity insurance.

And indemnity insurance is when you're designing.

Now, the reality is when we're getting residential builds, we don't always get a plumbing design as part of that.

You know, we want to make sure that we don't see that.

It's okay.

The first part of that is that there's a natural evolution, you know, uh, as...

And we see our- Mickey and I see ourselves as custodians as, of this event.

So the, the natural stuff of, I suppose, contemporizing the event.

Runners want a good experience.

While there's a little bit of, there's always runners who like a bit of old school and very simple, there is still the piece of you have to have a contemporary event, you have to have correct processes, you need to have a very strong online presence, things that work digitally and form.

So you need to be contemporary, otherwise it becomes difficult or can be difficult or more complex for runners or more cumbersome.

Ha! Nice.

Uh, so let's talk about the app and that critical bit of the, uh, sentence I just read, "Filtered through Master Plumbers' local information." How have you trained Toby?

Yeah.

So what we've done is we've ring-fenced the information.

So if you take plumbing, dr... gas fitting, drain laying, huge amount of standards, and then you throw in the building code, the Gas Act, um, and all the relevant standards, uh, they're normally joint standards, Kathryn, so we've got to, um, collaborate with Australia.

So that, in essence, for our listeners, is three thousand five hundred pages of documents.

Now, they used to be printed out in a van, in a ute, and normally on site, in a pretty, um, terrible state normally.

And then to find and, and, and actually research what part of the code you are looking for, and particularly for an apprentices, was challenging, right?

Where would the money have been saved, um, if they'd been a bit more onto being able to deal with this proposal quicker? W-who would have saved money where?

I mean, because obviously we're running out of land in Wilmington, but how do you guys feel about, or how do you feel kind of about just the home building industry here in this area? Yeah.

Um, generally I think this area, I still feel positive on, I feel really positive on North.

First of all, let's talk about our state, right? I think the state of North Carolina, uh, is a phenomenal state to live in and certainly to move to if you're from out of state, right? I mean, we've got within a six-hour drive, you can be in some of the most beautiful mountains on the planet and some of the most beautiful beaches on the planet all within the same day.

So I think that North Carolina, and this is a big, you know, I'm not trying to say that we're anywhere near as beautiful as California, but I feel like for the East Coast states, right, for the East Coast, I can't think of a better state to live in than North Carolina.

And I think a lot of people, I agree just by, if you look at the data, I think that, you know, I went to that housing economic forum that they do every year, and they bring in the professor from UNCW and a couple other national economists, one from the Realtor Association and one from the Homeowners Association.

But anyway, North and South Carolina were the two most...

the biggest gainers of net in-migration, not so much on a volume basis, but maybe on a percentage basis, however that shakes out.

Is, is that something that makes more sense versus finding a completely brand new lot and it's more difficult to then build and get the permitting and everything else versus one that there already was a house there that might be a teardown or there was a house there and,

Why not?

Look, it's the capital cost.

So we're getting...

I mean, let me be clear, though.

We're not against heat pump hot water technology.

We're not against solar.

And there's electric...

get cheaper at any point ever in the future, is it?

Why not?

Look, it's the capital cost.

So we're getting, I mean, let me be clear though, we're not against heat pump hot water technology.

We're not against solar and there's electric, it's horses for courses and people have to make decisions.

Two-tier market though, just need to remember, I remind listeners that LPG in the South Island, no shortage of LPG at all.

Yes, there's some price pressure for that, but no shortage of LPG.

And we do have LPG reticulated in some places in the South Island.

get cheaper at any point ever in the future, is it?