Grammar of Assent

So I think that's what Newman can give to us today.

Um, and, and, and finally, I would just say Newman had this great understanding of, and he talks about it a lot in the Grammar of Ascent, how do we come to know our faith? And Newman talks about notional ascent, which is m- understanding the faith purely through reason, and the, the...

and that's, that's important.

But he said more important is what he called real ascent, where we come to know not just about Jesus, we come to know Jesus himself as our personal savior.