Falklands War

We-- In order for people to talk candidly and say things like, "Well, when I was under Secretary of State, uh, during the Suez, uh...

My grandfather, uh, told me that the Suez, he was s- under Secretary of State, and this is what the s- the scoop was on the Suez." Or another person says, "Well, you know, I was there during the Falklands War, and everybody got it wrong.

This is what really happened." Well, you don't wanna q- they don't wanna be quoted.

Yeah.

I- In going back and reading all of the excellent work you've done for Foreign Affairs over the years, I was struck by a line in a piece you wrote in 2006.

This was after you'd done the UK's official history of the Falklands War.

And in reflecting on kind of European or British views of, of the American approach to the use of force, you wrote, "The problem with Washington since World War II has been not so much its predilection for using military force as a first resort as its hesitation and uncertainty when going to war." Is that the kind of flip side of the short war fallacy, that it's kind of a lack of commitment to a serious war because of that delusion, or is there, there some other dynamic intention with that?

It, it is a problem.

Uh, not just, just not asking the difficult questions.

Not asking if that doesn't work, what do you do instead?

I went back and read the first piece you ever wrote for Foreign Affairs, which was in 1982, shortly after the, the Falklands War, and there was a line that, that jumped out at me.

Quote, "The search is already underway for the lessons of the war.

[laughs]

But I've been reading the, the Official History of the Falklands Campaign by Sir Lawrence Freedman, who, uh, is a brilliant historian and a friend of mine.

I was reading about the buildup to what happened in 1982.

There are several reasons for that.

He also apparently does not know that Sea Lion's operator is Israeli and owns 65% of the project.

Regardless, what's going on here? Why suddenly is there so much interest in the islands 44 years since Britain won the Falklands War? And do these new threats carry any weight? Could Argentina actually attack the islands? And could Britain still defend them? Here to answer these questions is defence editor Mark Nicol.

We're here today to discuss the topic of the Falklands, which has found itself back in the news sort of out of nowhere, it feels like, of late.

I guess the angle I'd like to start with is sort of why...

The bubble has burst in terms of his popularity.

He is propped up by Donald Trump with significant billion-dollar loans without which the Argentine economy would be in dire straits.

So predictable that he would raise the Falklands War issue now.

But his timing has been quite clever.

P-8s, we could put a P-8 up over there.

The other thing to think about is it's like the Falklands War.

When that kicked off, we got asked to do something.

It wasn't to commit ourselves to the Falklands War.

It was to commit our then Leander-class frigates to another theatre to relieve pressure.

So, again, collective security can come in many manners, many ways.

But I mean, she had the advantage, which maybe is an advantage that Andy Burnham might have, which she obviously had a completely fractured and divided opposition that, that, that...

And obviously also the, what turned out to be the get out of jail free card of the, of, of the popular boost that she got from, from the Falklands War that gave her the political space.

And if it hadn't been for the Falklands War, you know, British history would've been, would've been very different, and that perception of Margaret Thatcher would've been, would've been very, would've been very, very different.

But to g- to, again, take the conversation right back to the beginning, that's kind of what I'm saying in relation to Andy Burnham.

That's kind of what Andy Burnham's strategy is.

Uh, when, so, for example, um, America and Britain, obviously there's, there's been some sort of anti-British feeling and vice versa way back to 1776, apparent, um, in the, uh, um, uh, Second World War, for example.

Sorry, apparent in the, the Falklands War, for example.

Um, and, and, and is, there's always been, the, the ambivalence with Ireland has been, you would have expected, you were talking, the interesting question you asked about two Republicans.

Um, you would have expected there to be more American support for Ireland in 1921.

I do think the story is a little bit more nuanced than that, though.

I mean, before the Falklands War in 1982, in which the Argentine dictatorship...

I think what's interesting for Argentinians is that they really do care about this issue so very much.

They call it the Malvinas and they care about the Falkland Islands so very much, so much so that it's almost always invoked as a nationalistic, sort of a low risk, high reward thing to say for us as a politician.