Debra Searle

It was, she was five grand.

And, um, so a massive differential [laughs] and, um, compared to Steve, and her name was Deborah Searle.

And anybody that was at that 2014 convention will still remember Deborah Searle's talk.

Mm-hmm.

And it, and whilst Steve Wozniak helped me sell the tickets, Deborah Searle gave the beef, and she was the person-

Yeah

... that had the biggest impact.