David Trimble

Absolutely.

And that's what a lot of people, I mean, can you imagine if you're somebody who was in the Austrian Unionist Party at the time when Geoffrey Donaldson walked out of the Good Friday talks at the point where he was doing everything he could to destroy that agreement, to bring down David Trimble, ultimately leaving to join the DUP at a point where they were an anti-agreement unionist party.

And yet here he is talking about himself as if he's David Trimble, basically.

I mean, he is at the heart of things.

He spent decades working on the peace process.

He clearly was a smart man, is a smart man.

He's been around politics for a very long time from his teens.

He's worked with Enoch Powell, with Jim Molyneux, with David Trimble, with all sorts of big beasts of politics.

Absolutely.

And that's what a lot of people, I mean, can you imagine if you're somebody who was in the Austrian Unionist Party at the time when Jeffrey Donaldson walked out of the Good Friday talks at the point where he was doing everything he could to destroy that agreement, to bring down David Trimble, ultimately leaving to join the DUP at a point where they were an anti-agreement unionist party.

And yet here he is talking about himself as if he's David Trimble, basically.

I mean, he is at the heart of things.

He spent decades working on the peace process.

He clearly was a smart man, is a smart man.

He's been around politics for a very long time from his teens.

He's worked with Enoch Powell, with Jim Molyneux, with David Trimble, with all sorts of big beasts of politics.

It was an awful, horrific tragedy, actually.

There was... two best friends a Catholic and a Protestant were both shot dead Damien Traynor and Philip Allen in the railway bar yeah and it was just when the negotiations of the Good Friday Agreement were really heating up and Seamus Mallon and David Trimble God rest them both both went to the mothers respective mothers houses and I think all the political parties decided then that they have to push this over the line.

The scale of it.

These things can't be repeated

Yeah, but it is so...

Like David Trimble and the sort of the...

DUP and the loyalist side use the fact that he is a former, well, you know, that he's in the IRA or they did time for trying to blow up a British military base.

They use that as a reason not to talk with them and negotiate with the group.

And this is the first iteration of that like 10,000 orange order support in Drum Cree.

So they all meet up at Drum Cree and demand to march down Garrahy Road.

So on the 10th of July, DUP leader Ian Paisley and future UUP leader David Trimble, they hold a rally at Drum Cree.

Paisley tells a crowd of thousands, there can be no turning back on this issue.

And that connection was very obvious when we saw how the Orange Order welcomed people like the head of the, the murder squads, Billy Wright, and cheered Billy Wright and his comrades up at Drumcree, where they had no hesitation.

Even the local ha- MP, David Trimble, had absolutely no hesitation in meeting the man who was responsible for murders of his constituents here in this area.

I can think of the like of, as I said, young Darren Murray, 11 years of age.

Out one day do- playing down near the Orange Hall at Corkcran.

It was David...

In 198- 98, David, uh, Trimble and John Hume were awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for brokering the North- Northern Ireland Peace Accord.

So that was, uh, um, to have peace in Northern Ireland as far as that goes.

And Tina's saying good morning to MST on the Twitch side to the Rumble side.

The idea of a shared society...

I mean, like, for example, for example, I mean, one of the images that will come out of the recent sort of Garvahi thing, which was completely needless, obviously, is that Carla Lockhart's the Queen of Ulster, the triumphant sort of cheering, holding it, just bringing us back to Trimble and Paisley, you know, all of that.

But my question is this, what is the point of all of that? Where does it take us as a society?

Joe, you've just framed your entire question on building a progressive and shared Northern Ireland on the premise that 35 orange men looking to work in peaceful silence is somehow an impediment.

And John showed how to do that, and provided the language to do that.

Without David Trimble, we wouldn't have been able to sway the bulk of Unionism to accept that movement-

Mm

... and to go into power sharing.

So I think the Nobel got it right.

I think th- those two leaders were absolutely essential to doing that.

But then you also had Ian Paisley and the step that he took, and, you know, for, it was difficult for David Trimble.

It must have been even more difficult for Ian Paisley to do that.