Condolences to you because I know you two were close.

Yeah, you know, first off, I appreciate you com- having me come on to talk about him today because, you know, as I sat there, um, on the plane last night, I was traveling when I heard, you know.

Butchie texted me, and I really didn't have words for it.

Um, and sometimes, you know, you're sitting on an airplane, you're by yourself, you've got your headphones on, and, and I just...

So many emotions, uh, Jeff, because Barry just, he meant a lot to me, and I, I took more of a selfish approach, and I didn't think about even the rest of the hockey world, um, because I, I had so much love for Barry in my heart, and I, I just...

You know, he treated me so well, and when I think about the success that I've had with ESPN and, you know, I get to work the Frozen Four every year, and that wouldn't have happened if he didn't approve it.

The first year I got moved up to the crew with him and John Buccigross, he had to be okay with it because for 15 or 20 straight years, he was the only guy, and he didn't share the airtime.

Mm

yeah

John Carlson, they offered more money too, right? He took less because he looked at Tampa Bay and said, I have a better chance to win.

Not sure if that's really true.

Like, is Tampa Bay really competing with the big dogs right now? Like, I think the rubbers kind of met the road with Tampa Bay.

Like, I think those guys are closer to a rebuild than a Stanley Cup again.

And I'm not saying that they...

I'm not saying that they're going to commit to a rebuild as long as they have that general manager who's super aggressive.

you on the

[laughs]

Um, listen, no Connor McDavid in the playoffs is gonna take some of the juice out of the playoffs.

Like w- w- no matter what fan base you're a part of, Connor McDavid is Connor McDavid.

So, um, I, I do think I would agree that this year's playoffs have not been the most entertaining, and I, I'll stand on that.

But I don't agree necessarily that there's no good stories here.

And, and I...

Listen, anybody...

That's a shame.

[laughs]

[laughs]Listen, no Connor McDavid in the playoffs is gonna take some of the juice out of the playoffs.

Like, w- no matter what fan base you're a part of, Connor McDavid is Connor McDavid.

So, um, I, I do think I would agree that this year's playoffs have not been the most entertaining, and I, I'll stand on that.

But I don't agree necessarily that there's no good stories here, and, and I ...

Listen, anybody ...

And, and I get it, this is controversial, but Carter Hart coming back into the National Hockey League and playing the way he's playing, um, I mean, eh, I think John Tortorella taking a team over with eight games left or whatever, five games left.

That's a shame.

What do you think?

So I, um, I don't agree with it, right? Like, I don't agree with it as far as holding him back, uh, to coach because it's like, "Okay, you're not good enough for, for us." Um, but I gotta say, I think it's smart business by Kelly McCrimmon.

I really do.

I, I, it, it, it's like I do have a brother who's a lawyer as well, um, you know, who would, who would probably say the same thing Berkey did, and I, I think Bruce Cassidy is, is one of these coaches that probably can add more.

You know, I always say it's like an 80/20 rule.

A coach can make you maybe 20% better as a team or 80% worse.

Um, you know, maybe the really, really good ones it's like 30/70 type of deal.

Yeah

What do you make of Toronto's current blue line, and what do you think they need to add here?

Well, I think the first thing is what Rosie said is so true, right? You, you, you get frustrated with a guy, but you're putting him in a situation to fail.

You're asking him to take match-ups that he can't.

And I, I think this happens a lot at it-- I think it even happens in the playoffs, um, so frequently, where, you know, a guy gets injured, and it's not always so much about the guy you're missing, but a lot of times it has to do with the guys that are having to move up and play in roles in which they're not capable.

So I, I think Jake McCabe would be a guy that I've got time for all day long, and he's a guy that, um, I, I'm keeping.

And, and again, if you're expecting him to be your f- your, your number one, you're, you're asking him to be something that he's not.

But if you pair him with your top guy, or you, you know, you play him on the second power or on the second pairing with a guy who gets up and down the ice well and moves the puck, well, now I think all of a sudden you've put him in a situation where, you know, he, he can be a lot more successful.

And along those lines, think there's any chance they could pry David Carle out of Denver?

What do you make of Toronto's current blue line, and what do you think they need to add here?

Well, I think the first thing is what Rosie said is so true, right? You, you, you get frustrated with a guy, but you're putting him in a situation to fail.

You're asking him to take match-ups that he can't.

And I, I think this happens a lot.

It, it, I think it even happens in the playoffs, um, so frequently where, you know, a guy gets injured, and it's not always so much about the guy you're missing, but a lot of times it has to do with the guys that are having to move up and play in roles in which they're not capable.

So, I, I think Jake McCabe would be a guy that I've got time for all day long, and he's a guy that, um, I, I'm keeping.

And, and again, if you're expecting him to be your f- your, your number one, you're, you're asking him to be something that he's not.

And along those lines, think there's any chance they could pry David Carr out of Denver?

Do you think it's a great fit?

fit?Uh, listen, a, a great fit, it's, it's, I don't wanna say great fit because you just never know how personalities are gonna mesh together, right? And so I, I, I don't wanna sit here and, and s- use the word great.

Um, I wanna reserve that for if he does become the head coach and we see what the results are in, in 18, the next 18 months.

But do I think it's a good fit? Do I think it makes a lot of sense? I do.

Um, I think when you look at Bruce Cassidy, you know you're bringing in a coach that has a winning pedigree.

Um, you know you have a coach that has a very specific structure and style that he will bring to your team.

And, you know, one thing that I think Edmonton has struggled with, and even in the Cup run years when they flipped the switch, um, I think puck management has always been something that we've always looked back on and we've said, "You know..." Um, and, and, and I'm newer to Oilers nation bandwagon, and I, I've watched the Oilers so much more over the last two years than I ever have in my entire life because there's a great reason to.

No.

Do you think it's a great fit?

Uh, listen, a, a great fit? It's, it's, I don't wanna say great fit because you just never know how personalities are gonna mesh together, right? And so I, I, I don't wanna sit here and, and s- use the word great.

Um, I wanna reserve that for if he does become the head coach and we see what the results are in, in 18, the next 18 months.

But do I think it's a good fit? Do I think it makes a lot of sense? I do.

Um, I think when you look at Bruce Cassidy, you know you're bringing in a coach that has a winning pedigree.

Um, you know you have a coach that has a very specific structure and style that he will bring to your team.

And, you know, one thing that I think Edmonton has struggled with, and even in the Cup run years when they flipped the switch, um, I think puck management has always been something that we've always looked back on and we've said, you know.

[laughs]

Like what, what do you know about him? What do you think he can bring to that team?

Yeah, I mean, look, the kid has tremendous skills, and he always plays with his head up.

You know, I mean it, it's, um, you watch him out there and it-- you can just kinda tell, like he's always surveying, right? I mean, a-and you know, he goes in and he goes right to Providence and, and, you know, he has one goal, but he has a bunch of assists and, and, and look, I haven't, I haven't seen him play pro.

You know, I've been kinda pretty deep into the NCAA tournament, getting ready for a tournament when, you know, you find out what four teams you're covering on Sunday at four o'clock, and then on Tuesday you're on a plane and you got 80 players that you gotta familiarize yourself with or more.

So I haven't seen any of his, his pro games, but I mean, I think the one area where I think he can help Boston right away is, is the power play, like Martone.

You know, like I, I could see at, at, at, you know, on the power play, him being able to impact a game as much as, as Martone.

I mean, Martone gets the game winner the other night in overtime, five on three for Tuch to put him out there.

They don't beat themselves

Mm-hmm.

It's an intent to injure play, and that's where this should have not have been less than five games.

And what I've come to realize, and I'm not someone who yells and screams at George Parros from the mountaintops.

I'm really not.

Like, this isn't a hockey play.

This is a, "I wanna hurt you.

I wanna injure you," and he...

Yep.

Mm-hmm.

...

he sits on the throne and then everybody else is somewhere below.

And you can argue who's two, who's three, then who's four and five in these little clusters of superstars, but McDavid is truly the best player on the planet.

His situation had to be handled differently.

I personally believe that, um, he, just like everybody said, he woke up today and just decided, "I'm good with this.

I'm not gonna go long term, and I don't wanna talk about this now for more than the next day or two with everybody else." This is the quintessential superstar hockey player, um, you know, whatever's bigger than a superstar, whatever the next word would be, but this is hockey in a nutshell.

But does it feel to you like Connor McDavid has started a countdown clock?

Mm-hmm.

Like, he sits on the throne and then everybody else is somewhere below.

And you can argue who's two, who's three, and who's four and five, and these little clusters of superstars, but McDavid is truly the best player on the planet.

His situation had to be handled differently.

I personally believe that, um, he, just like everybody said, he woke up today and just decided, "I'm good with this.

I'm not gonna go long term and I don't want to talk about this now for more than the next day or two with everybody else." This is the quintessential superstar hockey player, um, you know, whatever's bigger than a superstar.

Whatever the next word would be, but this is hockey in a nutshell.

But does it feel to you like Connor McDavid has started a countdown clock?

Hm.

"I'm not gonna honor my commitment." I signed a commitment to come play there.

That means that the agent, that means that, um, you know, the college program, which was, is Michigan, were obviously having conversations with a player that was already committed to go there, and I, I don't like that at all, Geoff.

And, and I obviously...

I, I come from the NCAA path.

I've spoken on your show and others about how I was very, very close to going to play in the Ontario Hockey League, and had the rules been the way that they are now, I probably would have done that.

It was something that we were highly, highly interested in, uh, in doing.

Hmm.

Do you have a thought on what we saw in that six and a half minutes where Dallas not only got back into the game, but took the lead and never relinquished it?

Well, the- I think the first one, um, you know, Marshman i- is, is a strong hockey player.

I mean, that, that guy, he goes to the dirty areas.

So when he creates that real estate right in front of Skinner, and he's in the blue paint, he's got one foot in, you know, his heels, he's in, he's a little bit out, I think Darnell Nurse makes the decision as, as, as you're kinda taught at this point and, and the way the game is, is coached now is he's just gonna front Marshman.

And, and that way you stay loose as a defenseman in front, um, especially 'cause he's the strong side guy.

So if there is a low play, he's the one, Darnell Nurse, who has to have enough freedom to move to the side.

So right then and there you have a double screen.

Mm-hmm.

In the NHL, probably a landing place that the NHL looks at and says, "Okay, quieter, quieter market."

Yeah.

I, I, look, I'm, I'll say this.

N- I don't know Joel Quenneville well at all, um, but I- I- I would say that I'm happy to see that he's got an opportunity to come back into the National Hockey League because, you know, uh, you know, we don't need to re- relitigate what happened.

It's, it's well out there, it's well-known, but what I do know 'cause I know people that are close to him, are the efforts that he has taken and the steps that he has taken over the last number of years, um, you know, to educate himself and to figure out where he went wrong and how he could've handled things better and start giving his time back to other areas and, and, you know, working with, with young players and young people and, and...

Look, we, we can't...

In every other walk of life, you, you make a mistake, you pay a price for it, regardless of what that price may be and what walk of like, li- life we're talking about.

Hmm.

Like, there'll be like a month-long stretch like we saw in December where they're the best team in the NHL, and then there'll be stretches where we say to ourselves, "How are these guys gonna do anything in the playoffs?" If the series started, of course, like, McDavid and Leon out, so it's- it sort of biased the question, but if the series started now, I don't know that the Oilers roll them at all.

I- I think it's LA's year.

I- I do.

We've b- we were started talking about that about a week or two ago, um, o- on Morning Cuppa Hockey because we had Tyler come on and- and, you know, obviously we always try to talk about Edmonton when he comes on.

Look, I'll just say this really quick.

You know, we talked about flipping a switch.

I- I don't see it as super alarming to not have those two guys right now, Jeff.

Hmm.