Right.

"And, or does it have a positive..." So I said, "Okay, I, I've, I have half-written this." So it was a great pleasure to do it properly, or, well, what I think is properly, and to say, "Well, it's not for everybody.

Not everyone wants to, uh, always be a- An awkward cuss, or, uh, out of step or against the stream.

But if, if that's, if, if you do feel that the consensus doesn't speak for you, if there's something about you that makes you feel that it's, would be worth being unpopular or marginal for the chance to lead your own life, and have a life instead of a career, or a job, then I can promise you it is worthwhile.

Yeah.

It is.

And, um-

It didn't come from your-

Well, now, but, well, why can't you acknowledge that about religion?

The same is true, the, the, the same is true, re- Well, because first, it comes from the childhood of our species when we had no information and didn't know there was germ theory of disease, didn't know we lived on a round planet, didn't know that it went around another round object, didn't know anything really.

But so we just adopted the first and most primitive explanation, and I think it's time we outgrew it.

Second, religion degenerates our morality.

I think that's the most important point.

People say that without religion, we wouldn't know right from wrong.

In other words, we are, our self-respect is impugned in the most, uh, deep way by the suggestion that we would only do a right action out of, uh, the hope of reward or, or, or avoid an evil one out of fear of punishment.

So why does, why doesn't that reflect on secularism?