Boris Epshteyn

It's the first chapter.

Um, he's a lawyer who does a deal with Boris Epstein and the Trump administration that Judge Beryl Howell describes as illegal and unconstitutional.

Just tell me about this story and tell me what it says about the legal profession when lawyers are doing deals that are illegal and unconstitutional.

Yeah, I guess my perspective on this is that if lawyers don't stand for the rule of law, who will? I mean, there's certain, there seem to be some, uh, principles that are so basic to what you do.

He's 39.

He was brought into the Trump administration by Boris Epshteyn.

He's now the number two person at the Department of Justice, Todd Blanche's deputy, and he's the one who signed his name to the appeal to resurrect the slush fund and to protect Trump's tax immunity.

The DAG, number two.

The Wall Street Journal has been doing the most amazing reporting on the corruption.

Um, it's been reporting a lot about, about, uh, Boris Epshteyn, about, um, Sullivan & Cromwell, about, um, th- this, uh, deal involving the settlement of the DOJ's case against, uh, Live Nation and Ticketmaster.

Right.

And they've been, and they've been writing about so much else.

So let me just ba- let me just back up and, and start with what you asked about.

Well, he likes Boris.

[laughs]

Well, yes.

I mean, but Bo- it, Boris is an...

Anyway, a d- different, different category.

But, but Boris really is actually sort of the, the platonic ideal for Trump in some ways because, a lawyer, because, um, y- you know, he tells Trump everything will be fine, and we talk about this in the book that, you know, that, that-

Yeah

Scott Bessent also is a notorious fighter, literally has had fistfights or threatened fistfights with members of Donald Trump's own administration, including b- uh, and people who were part of the transition team.

Boris Epshteyn, Donald Trump's lead lawyer, uh, Elon Musk, and others.

Fistfights.

So this pugilistic moron goes on the friendly environment of Fox News, you know, the propaganda channel for the Trump administration, with Lara Trump asking questions.

You know, they tore down the East Wing and now it's a military bunker and I'm in charge of that.

Mr. Epstein did not introduce me to my husband.

Mr. Epstein? Who is that? Who is that? I do not know a Mr.

Epstein.

She made her first public appearance in more than a month yesterday.

Last time, if you even call it an appearance, was at the World Cup final.

She was there in the courtroom every day.

I was in the courtroom in the back with Norm Eisen and the gang, and we're watching these proceedings, and they would come in every day, and she would print stuff out.

And so to the extent that someone goes to the White House and lobbies them, they're willing to take action.

So much so that there was a recent Wall Street Journal piece that had some pretty, uh, jaw-dropping episodes where, uh, the president, um, according to the Wall Street Journal, by urging from Boris Epstein, um, who's not part of the government and potentially paid, um, or at least suggested might be paid by a third party, was encouraging the president to encourage the DOJ to settle, which he did, and they had settlement negotiations at the White House, according to The Wall Street Journal, where the president himself put his head in the door of the negotiations, telling them to settle.

Um, the only thing, um, worse than that was the level of incompetence in how they did it, because they settled the case and then they forgot about the state attorneys general who stayed in the case, litigated it to a jury decision and won.

So Ticketmaster and Live Nation did all that lobbying but ended up losing the case anyway because the state AGs had the, um, wherewithal to continue.

We've also seen that here with Live Nation hiring Kellyanne Conway, hiring Richard Grinnell, Trump's choice to run the Kennedy Center on his board.

The Journal also reports that Boris Epstein, I think that's how you pronounce his name, Epstein or Epstein, right? Lori Trump's personal legal advisor also took an interest in resolving this case, although DOJ officials were apparently unsure whether he was acting for Trump, liaising, or both.

So, Mike, why do you think this tactic is so routinely employed?

I mean, I think it well, it works, you know, like getting your own personal acquaintances and yes, men, yes, women, neophytes into organizations, you know, builds credibility, builds confidence and builds good favor.