Border poll

Um, but, you know, there's a certain, um, snippiness on the part of the Taoiseach, uh, at the moment about talk of Irish unity.

Uh, and it also feeds in, I suppose, to what really is quite a deep antipathy, uh, between himself and, and Sinn Féin when it comes to the whole question of, um, a border poll and so on.

So, you know, it, it can have reverberations, uh, in a lot of different ways.

Uh, but at the same time, is it beyond, uh, Donald Trump to change his mind and, and say in a few weeks or a few months that he's actually a committed unionist?

He, you know, he gets that, uh, from it.

But for Micheál Martin, yeah, it is a tricky one, and it is awkward because Martin has not just been pushing his shared island initiative, which he thinks is the way to go, and there's a logic in that, of course, in, in trying to tackle maybe less contentious, uh, North-South questions and trying to generate a degree of, of, of trust and cooperation.

You know, there's a debate, uh, about that approach even within his own party, because there are those within Micheál Martin's own Fianna Fáil party who don't think he's green enough, uh, when it comes to this question of, of, of, of pushing, uh, for a border poll.

Um, so it places him in that position, but it, it also, just before the resumption of a new political term, because the Dáil will bec- you know, uh, w- will be a fractious place this autumn, um, Mary Lou McDonald, as president of Sinn Féin, and Micheál Martin do not make any attempts to hide their loathing, uh, for each other.

OK.

Moving on, just last week we had the Prime Minister in town and we and others asked him about a border poll and here's a reminder of what he had to say.

Some issues will be off the table and that is one of them.

In my view we've spent too much time in the last decade or so arguing about things and that's the effect of referenda, they create rifts that take a long time to heal.

And they will know how important Scotland is to maintaining a Labour government.

And therefore, if there's any sense that Scotland is going to become independent and the domino falls, you're realistically looking at, well, probably actually more reform than a Tory government in the longer term in England.

So I think he is mindful of the knock-on effect that a border poll would have here.

But I mean, look, ultimately others will disagree, but I think the Secretary of State was quite cute in his wording when he came into the job, where he said words to the effect, a paraphrase of, look, it's not high up my list of priorities.

in association with AIR.

Bit of bad news for anybody who was optimistic about the prospect of a United Ireland border poll anytime soon, because Andy Burnham has hammered a stake through the heart of those prospects, saying that a United Ireland or a poll about a United Ireland is off the table.

In a second, we're going to be talking to John Finucane, Sinn Féin MP for North Belfast.

But first, DUP MP Gregory Campbell is with us.

What Andy Burnham is saying is that he doesn't think the latter factor is there.

Therefore, the former isn't going to happen.

Yes, I think the way you framed that would imply that we were going into the room yesterday demanding that there would be a border poll today or next week or indeed next year.

That wasn't the case.

Peter Shorty, I do want to go back to you on something else.

Briefly, Andy Burnham in Belfast today saying that there won't be a border poll on his watch as Prime Minister.

That's a hard day to the 15th of August, 2029 for the next general election in the UK if indeed Andy Burnham gets that far.

What's your reaction to that?

Well, let me be clear.

I believe that there will be a border poll and the momentum is all going in that direction.

And we see more and more political parties, which is welcome in the South, coming out and supporting the border poll.

But this is part of the Good Friday Agreement and you can't pick and choose about it.