Bob Hoffman

Let's start with the big one, the negative love syndrome.

What does that mean, and why is that the core founding principle of, of Hoffman? And there's a famous Bob Hoffman quote, which is, "Everyone is guilty, but nobody is to blame."

The negative love syndrome is something that was, you know, you won't find it in, in other literature.

It's, it's Bob Hoffman's kind of original theory and how he approached the work.

And in his estimation, and, and we're, we're seeing this to be true, and it's not so far from what is also shown in a lot of developmental psychology.

But we as kind of infants, as, as babies and infants and into our toddler and into our young adolescence, you know, we're really dependent on Mom and Dad.

You're probably doing some self-reflection in that period of time, wondering, "How did I get myself here?" And, and maybe, and you correct me if I'm wrong, but maybe looking at, you know, places where you recognize, "Hey, I wasn't my best self.

I made some mistakes.

Yeah.

You and I both have been to Hoffman.

Yep.

I would love to talk a little bit about that because I think that came post selling Spanx.

I went-

Where did Hoffman come into your journey?

I sold Spanx November of n- 2021.

Yeah.

Um, you touched on this earlier, uh, but I just wanna press on it a little bit.

Um, I had Bob Hoffman on the podcast a few years ago, and he's written a lot about ad fraud.

And if you take that on, on the face value, there is an enormous amount of fraud in the media ecosystem.

Like, what's, what's your take on what's real and what's not, and, like, how much of every dollar ends up actually going to the end consumer?