Maybe to start off, can you talk a little bit about what sort of motivated that paradigm shift from complicated, uncomplicated to this more localized versus systemic paradigm.

So what motivated the shift is first the panel sat down and wrote our PICO questions, which basically fell into like the categories of like cystitis, complicated UTI, UTI in men.

And then we had to decide where we wanted to focus our attention first.

And we all felt that there were some existing guidelines for managing cystitis, but there was nothing about managing UTI in any other population other than premenopausal women.

And I've been a practitioner at the Houston VA for most of my career, and I take care of a lot of men.

And it always bothered me that we didn't have guidelines that applied to UTI in men.

So that's how the panel started out and decided we were going to work on complicated UTI guidelines first rather than uncomplicated because there were no guidelines for complicated from IDSA.

What's your view and the way that the IDSA guidelines have framed some of that discussion? about how to look at an individual patient who may not be as straightforward and what to do when they come in with worries about these these you know do i have an infection or those sorts of things

You are.

Okay.

So I think some of it may have been a misunderstanding between people th- thinking that, "Well, I went in and I only touched, like, the bed or the pillow, and I don't need to do anything." So, and then they're reporting that.

And then I also talked about the limitations of our observation.

But I think, yes, there's a lot of overconfidence.

I mean, if you survey...

I think, I mean, yes, all, uh, physicians and nurses have a lot of self-doubt, but at the same time, I think we're raised up to be fairly confident in our decisions.

Exactly.