Angus Robertson

Well, yes.

I mean, that's kind of you to say that, but I think it did, because I and many others in the 56 felt from quite early on that we were lacking in a strategic approach to the power we had as a third party, and we didn't feel that we were well led by Angus Robertson.

And just before Theresa May announced her snap general election in 2017, Alex Salmond and I had been plotting with other members of the group to replace Angus as the leader, either with myself or Alex Salmond.

Then, of course, the snap election happened, and we lost 21 of our 56 seats, including Alex and including Angus.

But it was a very unpleasant time in the party, and the party lost many, many members over this issue, and many people who perhaps didn't feel as strongly as I did as a lesbian feminist about this still felt that there was far too much attention, time, and energy being spent on this policy and not enough time and energy being spent on independence.

On that score, Jo, where do you think now the independence case is? And, you know, where, where is the SMP now in, in the sort of post-Murrell, post-Sturgeon era? Can you see a route to independence given Westminster's unwillingness to agree a second independence referendum and given the, the difficulties the SMP has been in? Although, of course, you know, the recent, uh, Scottish Parliament elections, it, it won again.

It won again, but it lost 10% of its vote, and some high profile seats, including Angus Robertson lost his seat again.

It essentially won because the opposition is so split.