I want to give maybe an example or two of that.

Yeah, one recent example is we had a particular pastor in an African nation who his understanding of biblical counseling was that actually he called it a fad.

He thought it was just something was here today, gone tomorrow.

And it was just something we all picked up on as some form of a strategy for church growth.

But as a result of just walking through the scriptures and walking through what the word has to say about the issue and ultimately a good ecclesiology.

He came to realize, my goodness, this is absolutely essential to the church.

This is what it means to be the church.

How do you think it will expand, not just biblical counseling, but also the good of the church in other nations? Just be a visionary for a moment.

And then Aaron, I'll give you a chance to answer from the other side where Niamh has taken a more of a proprietary approach.

Well, so I can talk a little bit about ACE's history with Voltron, why we chose it when we did, as I said, before Neve existed.

Open source as a fear-mongering tool, like sometimes people use that in the industry, but every product that we're talking about, every product deployed in the building today has open source technology in it, every single one of them.

So we sort of... built what we do around that ethos of, hey, we're gonna solve problems, but we're gonna solve them in the open so that other people can learn from how we solve these problems and build on them.

We just like the ethos, and then there was another thing that at the time when we got started, you know, this conversation would be very different because everybody on the call would be saying, there's no way in hell you're putting a computer on my network, like, that has some software on it that I don't know about that didn't come from my Johnson rep or my, you know, Seaton's rep or whatever.

At the time, Voltron being built by the National Labs, one of the great things about that is it was being built for use by utilities and doing demand management programs and that sort of thing.

So security was paramount, and DOE, the Department of Energy, the US Department of Energy, invested in security reviews, pen testing, all the stuff that Neve has to do for their product.

Am I doing this to meet the spec and to get the job if I'm a contractor? or am I a building owner that says, I'm looking at the total cost of ownership of this, and how do I operate and maintain this, and how do I do it in a cyber secure

You know what I mean? And so a- as you think about, uh, this dainty morsel, what, why, why is it that it, it feels so good or it tastes so good, if you will, to share information like this? Why are we so tempted in this way, and why is it so hard to say no to this temptation of gossip?

Yeah.

Some of the other reasons, again, like I said, it, it appeals to our sinful heart.

It appeals to our pride.

It appeals to our selfishness.

You know, it's, it's juicy in the sense that it's the idea of forbidden knowledge, something you're not supposed to know, and that triggers curiosity.

Uh, that's our Proverbs 9:17, right? "Stolen water is sweet and bread eaten in secret is pleasant." And so there's a little bit of that emotional charge to it.

Mm.