Sure.

But his early shows are very much, "Isn't this, isn't this guy weird and brilliant and a genius?" And you can see over the course of his, his work, he s- switches it round so that you're ...

It's about the person who he's doing the, the illusion for, and it becomes more about the audience and the effect it has on them and, and, and them doing something special rather than him having these special powers.

Right.

And it was...

And so I don't believe I saw a ghost, but I had the experience, the sort of...

So it was a terrible...

It was in the Jurys Inn, which is now a Leonardo, in, uh, a hotel function room in Middlesbrough.

How are you with that? Do you find that exciting?

Yes.

Although I think for me, excitement manifests in, um, anxiety, you know, I'm not nervous.

I mean, you seem cool as a cucumber at all times.

I never see you looking nervous.

before going on stage.

Some people have that real nervous energy that's physical about them before they go on, as if they're sort of building up to explode.

All good.

[laughing]

I love the independents, though, 'cause if you're gonna be an independent candidate, y- what you have to do is have a sensible policy immediately followed by a completely nuts policy.

It's always things like, "Tackle climate change, deport gray squirrels."

Of course you were.

[laughs] I was on the BFI player trying to watch a Dario Argento film, and I, I log- I logged in, and I pressed play.

And before it played it said, "Are you over 18?" Like, no, I'm a 10-year-old with a subscription to the BFI player.

[laughs] Of course, uh, just take it for granted that I'm over 18.

The legend transforms an ordinary arcade cabinet into a symbol of hidden power.

I might question you on one point there, because I think medieval stories, I think, were less obsessed with demons than, like, contemporary America is now.

Yeah.

Demons specifically, but fairies were a big deal.

Or whatever you call fairies where you are.

It's a different name in Ireland.

It's a different name in Scandinavia.

So Alistair, did Polybius, the arcade game, exist?

Yeah, yeah.

How could he have known? It's, so he, he's lost, um, Tim Allen from the sitcom Home Improvement in the '90s.

[audience laughs] Uh, reached for comment, he said, "Huh?" [audience laughs] No Home Improvement fans?He's lost, uh, Morgan McSweeney, the genius behind, um, his, his victory.

And, and McSweeney's big achievement was kicking the left out of the Labour Party.

And he's, he's, basically, he's my nemesis, and it's very disappointing to sort of finally see a picture of your nemesis, and he looks like Ed Sheeran.

[laughs]

I know, I know I don't seem like the most northern member of the panel with Rachel here.

But, yeah, I think it's time we had a northern Olympics.