So just curious, what does it mean? What does leadership mean for you in your role or maybe beyond your role? What do you think? Why is it important to build a deep tech company as you do to do the things you do on the leadership side?

Right.

So first of all, we've indeed shared experiences.

With Patrick, the responsibilities, with him being the CEO, me being the CTO.

Now we are, of course, both still as co-founders working together a lot on the whole company strategy and management and culture, right? Which is what you want to dive a bit into.

And it's true that it's been a subject very dear to me, leadership and culture, because I think, first of all, we didn't know anything about that before starting the company.

And my view on that, by the way, has evolved a lot since then, and I'm sure will keep evolving.

Can you maybe share one, two examples on those moments of magic for you?