Originating Depository Financial Institution

I will also say from Me and July did a bunch of third-party sender audits for the team, and this was not on anybody's plate, which is really disappointing, right? Because the rule is supposed to impact everybody equally.

So I think that might be to Avery's point on the ODFI side.

I still think they're struggling on what a program actually means, both for themselves and if they have third-party senders, trying to get it down to them as well.

And so I think that's kind of scary.

Okay, yeah, we can do this.

Interesting.

Joe, one of the other things to think about, like wrestling, people are wrestling with how much do I say as an ODFI because they have to strike that balance between, hey, go do this, but if the customer then suffers a fraud, they're going to say, hey, the bank told me to do it, and I do it.

And so I think that's part of the challenge as well, right? Overcomplication, but then within that overcomplication, being afraid to really say anything, right? And so...